Kite Strings

bobk wrote:At least until that effect wears off. Then you're in trouble again.

Tad Eareckson wrote:Hey Bob, what if he just ASSUMED that he was in trouble all the time for every launch and did something JUST PRIOR to every launch to verify his connection?

Extinction is the conditioning phenomenon in which a previously learned response to a cue is reduced when the cue is presented in the absence of the previously paired aversive or appetitive stimulus.

Helen McKerral - 2010/09/07 00:16:04 UTC
South Australia

There have been numerous threads in the past about unhooked launches and ways to prevent them. One constant poster, Tad, had an unfortunate brow-beating style that flooded threads and got him banned, but IMO his point was nonetheless valid; people simply got so annoyed by his style, they stopped listening and his message was lost.

Basically, the idea is that no matter whether you use the Aussie method or not (another emotive topic), or how you do your hang check (step through or hang, look, feel, whatever) the VERY LAST THING you do immediately before every launch is to lift the glider up off your shoulders so the hangstrap goes tight and you FEEL the tug of your legloops around your groin/thighs.

More important, I think, is a change in mindset: that you constantly assume that you are NOT hooked in. That is the default mindset and only after you've done the lift and tug - immediately before every launch - do you decide you're hooked in. Also, because the default assumption is negative rather than positive, you are much less likely to start any run unhooked.

The way I've tried to incorporate it is to make L&T the first part of the physical act of lifting the glider to my shoulders in preparation for launch ie instead of lifting it to my shoulders, I lift it higher (L&T), then lower it to my shoulders, then start my run. In strong conditions this is more difficult but I often launch with a tight hangstrap then anyway (always in the Malibu, occasionally in the Litesport).

I've adopted the lift and tug but I'm an old dog learning a new trick and I still forget to do it some of the time. However, although I've found that it's very hard to remember to do if you try to remember 'L&T', if you change your mindset to, "I'm not hooked in", it's easier to recall. It would be easier if I had learned it from the start, so it was a physical muscle memory instilled from my first days on the training hill, just like the grapevine grip changing to bottle.

Even if you don't follow the "mindset" part, it's an extra layer of security and there is no possible harm in it if it is an *additional* check; for me, a third one after Aussie method (hook harness to glider), hang check (look at biner, feel loop and riser, tug each leg strap), then walk to launch, do whatever (wait, set glider down etc.) and then the final lift and tug as I pick up my glider immediately before I start my run.

I won't go into any more pros and cons of any of these things, they've been debated ad nauseum and every possible permutation has already been covered, just do a few searches.

Allen Sparks - 2010/09/07 01:03:18 UTC
Evergreen, Colorado

Oscar,

I'm very happy you weren't injured.

Helen,

Thanks for the Tad 'lift and tug' reminder.

I have launched unhooked and experienced the horror of hanging by my fingers over jagged rocks ... and the surreal result - i.e. not being significantly injured.

I am a firm believer in 'lift and tug' and the mindset of assuming I am not hooked in. It is motivated by the recurring memory of my own experience ... and the tragic deaths and life-altering injuries of good friends.

Helen McKerral (in 2010) wrote:One constant poster, Tad, had an unfortunate brow-beating style that flooded threads and got him banned ...

Helen McKerra (in 2010)l wrote:... people simply got so annoyed by his style, they stopped listening and his message was lost.

Helen McKerral - 2010/01/28 04:15:06 UTC
Adelaide Hills, South Australia

Hiya Tad,

I've been doing the lift and tug for some months now, after our discussion. It's good and it works.

Norm Boessler - 2010/01/11 13:24:30 UTC
Armidale, New South Wales

Lift and Tug - identified my absent leg loop - thank you!

Steven Sims - 2010/06/09 21:33:08 UTC

Ok, #3 there is over-thinking, I'll give you that (not that this means I'm going to stop thinking though). But bright paint and clipping the carabineer somewhere that I can see and feel it are both very simple to do, and I think, very worthwhile. I already know I'm not going to keep saying "I'm not hooked in," if I'm responding to some emergency or if I'm wire crewing for someone in front of me real quick.

Yes, I like the idea behind the last second Lift & Tug, and I may well adopt the Aussie method whenever I end up with a pod harness. I think the shoulder loop 'biner attachment may be even better than the Aussie method, though, since it seems more forgiving of emergency response situations.

I'm a LMFP student...

...and as you probably all know, the hang check is an integral part of their training.

I'm not too concerned about FTHI while I'm still doing supervised launches there, or even after because it is SOP to hang check before you step on the concrete ramp.

But later on, if I'm out of my element at a new site with a different layout and different culture, I'd prefer something that does not depend on my memory and sense of timing.

With each flight, demonstrates a method of establishing that the pilot is hooked in just prior to launch.

Rejection of orange carabineer based on fashion sense duly noted

Tad Eareckson wrote:Tad didn't NEED to learn anything from Helen's best efforts.

Helen McKerral (in 2010) wrote:One constant poster, Tad, had an unfortunate brow-beating style that flooded threads and got him banned ...

Helen McKerra (in 2010)l wrote:... people simply got so annoyed by his style, they stopped listening and his message was lost.

Warren Narron - 2010/09/14 15:01:39 UTC

Every banning that I have experienced has also had an element of cowardice.

Tad Eareckson wrote:

Warren Narron - 2010/09/14 15:01:39 UTC

Every banning that I have experienced has also had an element of cowardice.

Yeah Bob, I'm EXTREMELY dangerous to some people. Wasn't it cool the way USHGA practically imploded because of one little draft letter to the FAA I posted a couple years ago? I can still do stuff like that. Knowledge is power.

I believe Warren's quote doesn't apply here.

...then I wouldn't be posting so boldly on your own forum.

...but here I am posting in your "living room".

So you can drop the line that you were banned out of cowardice.

Try again, and maybe include some of your own actions this time.

fakeDecoy - 2010/06/09 21:44:37 UTC
Fort Funston

I'd just be compulsive about it like FPeel. If I'm approaching launch, I stop at launch and the last thing I do before considering whether to launch is to check several things without assistance, the last being the carabiner. If I do anything else before launching, or a couple minutes pass, I do it again. We don't need more gadgets or indicators. Just nail down a procedure.

With each flight, demonstrates a method of establishing that the pilot is hooked in before considering whether to launch or a couple of minutes prior to actually doing it.

Bob Kuczewski - 2010/06/09 21:49:53 UTC

Despite my previous design, that's what I actually do.

But new ideas come from new perspectives. If you have the energy to do something, then give it a try before you become old and set in your ways as most of us have.

George Whitehill - 1981/05

The point I'm trying to make is that every pilot should make a SECOND check to be very certain of this integral part of every flight. In many flying situations a hang check is performed and then is followed by a time interval prior to actual launch. In this time interval the pilot may unconsciously unhook to adjust or check something and then forget to hook in again. This has happened many times!

If, just before committing to a launch, a second check is done EVERY TIME and this is made a HABIT, this tragic mistake could be eliminated. Habit is the key word here. This practice MUST be subconscious on the part of the pilot. As we know, there are many things on the pilot's mind before launch. Especially in a competition or if conditions are radical the flyer may be thinking about so many other things that something as simple as remembering to hook in is forgotten. Relying on memory won't work as well as a deeply ingrained subconscious habit.

In the new USHGA rating system, for each flight of each task "the pilot must demonstrate a method of establishing that he/she is hooked in, just prior to launch." The purpose here is obvious.

Rob Kells - 2005/12

Always lift the glider vertically and feel the tug on the leg straps when the harness mains go tight, just before you start your launch run. I always use this test.

My partners (Steve Pearson and Mike Meier) and I have over 25,000 hang glider flights and have managed (so far) to have hooked in every time.

Steven Sims - 2010/06/09 22:42:26 UTC

Yes Bob, fresh H2 and still don't know how much I don't know.

I'm glad to know I'm not the only mad scientist here, but now I guess I'm going to have to work up some numbers too, instead of just daydreaming about it.

The magnet / Hall effect sensor system does have advantage in that you wouldn't have to make any connections. The presence of the magnet on the 'biner will change the sensor's voltage and the microcontroller will read this voltage and light the LEDs accordingly. I think this would be a reliable system because (with a little calibration and error detection code in the microcontroller) a short in the sensor circuit would not lead to a false positive, but certainly that would need to be tested. I can't think of anything I pilot is likely to have near the carabiner that could create a false magnetic field...maybe if their iPod earbuds got tangled up in there somehow, LOL.

I thought separate green = 'go' and red = 'no-go' LEDs would be better, but you bring up a good point if switching gliders, or even if the system fails outright. I might have trained myself to just look to make sure there was no red light, but if I am instead accustomed to looking for only a green light, and now do not see it, I do think I'd fall back to a lift and tug or something at that point.

I don't yet know how strong the magnet must be, how well the sensor will detect the magnetic field carried by the carabiner, nor how much current the sensor would flow. The microcontroller could switch the sensor on n times per second with some short duty cycle to conserve the battery, though. A small solar cell could be an option too, and then maybe it could be an always on system until the microcontroller sees no voltage from the solar cell for 10 minutes (because it is in the glider bag), so it turns itself off like a calculator.

Microcontroller would be a low power PIC of some flavor and is $3-$5, Hall effect sensor is $5, LEDs, tiny rare earth magnet, wiring, etc., a few more $. Not sure what the battery and/or solar would cost yet, as that depends on the power requirements.

Has anyone every built a prototype hook-in sensor system that you know of? I'm sure there are a lot of practical problems that would have to be solved, like survival of the wiring among all the flexing during flight and transport, whack impact forces, etc.

Bob Kuczewski - 2010/06/09 22:54:19 UTC

I haven't heard of anything, but let me know if you build something yourself. You can put me on the list of beta testers!!

I've programmed PICs before (back in the 90's) and even then, I was able to make one that ran 8 pretty bright LEDs for a long time with just a few watch batteries. The PIC is the way to go because you can program all kinds of features and they're very cheap. I started with the "burn once" variety, but moved over to the flash versions toward the end of my project (that shows how long ago it was). It's funny how much we've progressed since then ("pardon me while I reflash my hook in sensor from my cell phone").

Keep thinking my friend, but please be very very careful. I don't ever want to read that you failed to hook in because you were relying on a technology that failed you.

With each flight, demonstrates a method of establishing that the pilot is hooked in just prior to launch.