http://groups.yahoo.com/group/skysailingtowing/message/4633
Weaklinks and aerotowing (ONLY)
Steve Kroop - 2005/02/10 04:50:59 UTC
Cc: Rohan Holtkamp ; Paris Williams
Davis,
Your weak link comments are dead on.
But when have any of Davis's comments on ANYTHING been anything *BUT* dead on?
Yet as dead on as Davis's comments were...
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=31052
Poll on weaklinks
Davis Straub - 2013/03/06 18:29:05 UTC
You know, after all this discussion I'm now convinced that it is a very good idea to treat the weaklink as a release, that that is exactly what we do when we have a weaklink on one side of a pro tow bridle. That that is exactly what has happened to me in a number of situations and that the whole business about a weaklink only for the glider not breaking isn't really the case nor a good idea for hang gliding.
I'm happy to have a relatively weak weaklink, and have never had a serious problem with the Greenspot 130, just an inconvenience now and then.
I'm thinking about doing a bit more testing as there seemed to be some disagreement around here about what the average breaking strength of a loop of Greenspot (or orange) weaklink was.
...how come he really wasn't all that convinced of his dead onness until after all that discussion that came in the wake of one of you Questie assholes being lethally inconvenienced a short time after his Davis Link increased the safety of the towing operation?
And how come you were nowhere to be heard to help bolster his faith in the dead onness of his comments - 'specially when he himself was using new orange stuff Morningside decided they were happy with?
I have been reading the weak link discussion in the OR with quiet amusement.
Oh, aren't you just so superior to us weekend warrior muppets who ACTUALLY *ENGAGE* in discussions in efforts to get things on track while douchebags like you plant your useless goddam asses in front of screens and watch us in quiet amusement.
Quiet, because weak links seem to be one of those hot button issues...
What are the other hot buttton issues?
- bridles that connect to the pilot and glider being three point?
- short thick versus long thin bridles for wrap resistance?
- releases within easy reach versus ones that DON'T stink on ice?
- straight versus bent pin releases and the ability to engage thick rope without using a weak link?
- the best color line for hook knife lanyards?
- wheel landings being more dangerous than standups because you're leading with your head?
- angle of attack being synonymous for pitch attitude?
- hook-in checks versus just running off the ramp because you KNOW you're hooked in?
- whether or not:
-- a pro toad bridle pulls the pilot forward of the basetube and wipes out the top half of his available speed range?
-- using weak links on both ends of the bridle doubles max tow tension?
...that brings out the argumentative nature of HG pilots...
Can you give me some examples supporting this concept you have of hang glider pilots having inherent argumentative natures? Jim Keen-Intellect Rooney seems to think that...
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=31052
Poll on weaklinks
Jim Rooney - 2013/03/03 19:37:19 UTC
My response is short because I've been saying it for years... and yes, I'm a bit sick of it.
This is a very old horse and has been beaten to death time and time again... by a very vocal minority.
See, most people are happy with how we do things. This isn't an issue for them. They just come out and fly. Thing's aren't perfect, but that's life... and life ain't perfect. You do what you can with what you've got and you move on.
But then there's a crowd that "knows better". To them, we're all morons that can't see "the truth".
(Holy god, the names I've been called.)
I have little time for these people.
It saddens me to know that the rantings of the fanatic fringe mask the few people who are actually working on things. The fanaticism makes it extremely hard to have a conversation about these things as they always degrade into arguments. So I save the actual conversations for when I'm talking with people in person.
A fun saying that I picked up... Some people listen with the intent of understanding. Others with the intent of responding.
I like that.
For fun... if you're not seeing what I mean... try having a conversation here about wheels.
...our inherent argumentative natures tend to peak out during conversations about wheels? Has that been your experience as well?
Isn't it actually the case that one hundred percent of "arguments" occur between people who know what the fuck they're talking about trying to deal with assholes like Kinsley Sykes who've incorporated all the moronic crap you flight park dickheads have been feeding them for decades?
Are pilots from non hang gliding flavors of aviation noted for having inherent argumentative natures? If so, can you tell me some of the topics they argue about? Is the standard aerotow weak link on the list? Or does everybody just use what the glider manufacturer says and never have it blow?
Don't you think that if hang gliders used weak links comparable to what sailplanes use and thus never blew any that hang glider pilots wouldn't have such argumentative natures?
...and also invokes the "not designed here" mentality...
- Again... Which is WHAT? Are there big wars going on between pilots who fly gliders and harnesses from the US, Australia, UK, France, Germany, Ukraine?
- So tell me about some of the aerotow industry crap that was actually DESIGNED by anybody - 'stead of just bent pin junk Bobby Fucking-Genius Bailey pulled out of his ass over two decades ago.
- Ever seen fistfights break out between Quallaby and Lockout releasers fanatically defending the engineering genius that went into their choices?
...and I really did not want to get drawn into a debate.
Guess you've seen what can happen to Industry dickheads who have.
Amusement, because I find it odd that there was so much ink devoted to reinventing the wheel.
Yeah, how 'bout that. So why do you think that there's been virtually NO ink devoted to stuff like glider, harness, parachute design and so much ink devoted to weak link "design" that...
http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1563
Platform Launching (PL) Draft suggestions needed
Bill Cummings - 2014/06/05 20:44:19 UTC
Some moderators have even lock down threads about weak-links rather than go stark raving mad.
...some moderators have even locked down threads about weak links rather than go stark raving mad? Are there just too many loonies in this sport who can't be reasoned with well enough to get them on board with universal 130 pound Greenspot? If so can you give us some names so we can work on getting this settled once and for all?
Collectively I would say that there have been well over a 100,000 tows in the various US flight parks using the same strength weak link with tens of thousands of these tows being in competition.
Wow! That's a really long track record!!!
Yes I know some of these have been with strong links...
What's a strong link? Can you express that in Gs? Or at least pounds?
...but only the best of the best aerotow pilots are doing this.
So what about THIS:
05-0903
guy?
23-1817
30-1824
A bit of a stretch to think he's one of the best of the best aerotow pilots - 'specially when he needs to land right after a Rooney Link increases the safety of the towing operation. And yet...
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=37786
Joe on plowing
Joe Schmucker - 2014/06/12 12:51:42 UTC
I use a 200lb three strand weak link or they break every time.
...he uses a stronglink heavier than the one the tug uses to pull a tandem. Doesn't that seem a bit odd to you? Isn't that way out of specs with the wheel you've had spinning for well over a hundred thousand tows in the various US flight parks?
Does...
Joe Schmucker - 2014/06/12 12:51:42 UTC
In that vid, I was 280. Add a 550 reserve from Betty, a harness and rocks in my head, I'm over 400 (300) hook-in weight.
...just hooking in over three hundred pounds make one one of the best of the best aerotow pilots? If I hooked in at over three hundred pounds could I be one of the best of the best aerotow pilots? If so, would I hafta eat my way to the top or would it be OK to just ballast up?
You are completely correct about weak links and lockouts. If I can beat the horse a little more...
Oh, PLEASE have pity on that poor horse! He's just been beaten SO MUCH over the decades! Pretty much ceaselessly.
Weak links are there to protect the equipment not the glider pilot.
Oh? So the best of the best aerotow pilots are all flying stronger gear than weekend warrior muppets? Those topless jobs with two millimeter racing wires will hold up a lot better than stock Sport 2s? I'da thunk the precise opposite? Bo? You got any thoughts on this one?
Anyone who believes otherwise is setting them selves up for disaster.
Sounds to me like we've got a lot of people setting them selves up for disaster.
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24846
Is this a joke ?
Jim Rooney - 2011/08/26 02:44:10 UTC
The "purpose" of a weaklink is to increase the safety of the towing operation. PERIOD.
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=22660
What can be learned from this "scooter" towing accident?
Mitch Shipley - 2011/01/31 15:22:59 UTC
Enjoy your posts, as always, and find your comments solid, based on hundreds of hours / tows of experience and backed up by a keen intellect/knowledge of the issues when it comes to most things in general and hang gliding AT/Towing in particular. Wanted to go on record in case anyone reading wanted to know one persons comments they should give weight to.
Sounds to me like even Steve...
Jim Rooney - 2011/08/25 04:55:25 UTC
I mean seriously... ridgerodent's going to inform me as to what Kroop has to say on this? Seriously? Steve's a good friend of mine. I've worked at Quest with him. We've had this discussion ... IN PERSON. And many other ones that get misunderstood by the general public. It's laughable.
...Kroop is setting himself up for disaster. Any chance you could wire him and alert him to the danger he's probably in? Of course we can't worry about all those other people setting them selves up for disaster but... STEVE KROOP ferchrisake! We CERTAINLY couldn't afford to have anything bad happen to HIM!
The pilot activating his or her releases is their way to save themselves.
You mean like THIS?:
01-001
04-200
07-300
10-307
15-413
Not entirely clear to me that this pilot activating his or her releases is doing that great of a job saving themselves. How 'bout you?
Any thoughts on looking into a more effective way for the pilot to...
25-32016
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5548/14306846174_185f09082e_o.png
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5530/14120804830_2aabd74d25_o.png
09-10817
...activate his or her releases? No, wait...
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30971
Zach Marzec
Jim Rooney - 2013/02/12 18:00:27 UTC
I just buried my friend and you want me to have a nice little discussion about pure speculation about his accident so that some dude that's got a pet project wants to push his theories?
Deltaman loves his mouth release.
BFD
I get tired as hell "refuting" all these mouth release and "strong link" arguments. Dig through the forums if you want that. I've been doing it for years but unfortunately the peddlers are religious in their beliefs so they find justification any way they can to "prove" their stuff. This is known as "Confirmation Bias"... seeking data to support your theory... it's back-asswards. Guess what? The shit doesn't work. If it did, we'd be using it everywhere. But it doesn't stand the test of reality.
Jim Keen-Intellect Rooney is tired as hell of "refuting" all these mouth release and "strong link" arguments. Dig through the forums if you want that. He's been doing it for years but unfortunately the peddlers are religious in their beliefs so they find justification any way they can to "prove" their stuff. This is known as "Confirmation Bias"... seeking data to support your theory... it's back-asswards. Guess what? The shit doesn't work. If it did, we'd be using it everywhere. But it doesn't stand the test of reality.
And, of course, it's not invented HERE.
A perfect analogy is the circuit breaker in your home, it is there to protect the wire not what you plug into the wall socket. If anyone does not believe me they can plug their car retrieve 2-way radio into the wall socket and watch it go up in flames with the circuit breaker cumfortably remaining in the on position (I hope no one really tries this
.
But if you're one of the best of the best chargers it's OK to burn up your radio with a higher capacity circuit breaker? I'm not sure I'm following this perfect anology all that well.
A discussion of the strength of weak links is incomplete without a discussion of the tow bridal.
Hey Steve... Do you find that when there are arguments about weak links the sides tend to divide along the lines of those who spell "bridal" with an "a" and those who spell it with an "e"?
I hear (read) strengths quoted...
Yeah? So what STRENGTHS (plural) do you hear QUOTED?
- I've heard strengths QUOTED from around 130, which is what they ACTUALLY TEST TO, to 260, which is what they're declared to break at when all the factors and variability that exist in the big, real world are included.
- How come after a couple of decades of the spinning of this highly tuned wheel of yours one of your top enforcement goons...
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=31052
Poll on weaklinks
Davis Straub - 2013/03/06 18:29:05 UTC
I'm thinking about doing a bit more testing as there seemed to be some disagreement around here about what the average breaking strength of a loop of Greenspot (or orange) weaklink was.
...is still thinking about tying it to more trees and bouncing himself on it so's he can pull more convenient numbers out of his ass?
...with respect to the combined pilot and glider weight yet this is meaningless info with out knowing what bridal configuration is used and where it is placed in the bridal system.
Isn't it traditional to place it between the second and third bridesmaids?
For example, a 200# weak link can allow between 200# and 800# of towline force depending on where it is placed within the various popular bridal configurations.
Do you have any photos showing us any of these various popular bridal configurations that don't have it at one end of a bridal engaged by a primary release such that it's either feeling half the towline tension one point or 65 percent for two? Asshole?
On the tow plane we use 1-1/2 loops (3 strands) of 130# line.
Really? I thought...
http://ozreport.com/5.126
Flytec Dragonfly
USAFlytec - 2001/07/14
Steve Kroop - Russell Brown - Bob Lane - Jim Prahl - Campbell Bowen
The tail section of the Dragonfly is designed so that it can accept in-line as well as lateral loads. Furthermore the mast extension, which is part of the tow system, is designed to break away in the event of excessive in-line or lateral loads. The force required to cause a breakaway is roughly equivalent to the force required to break the double weaklink used on the tail bridle. More simply put, the mast would break away long before any structural damage to the aircraft would occur.
...you used a double loop (four strands) on the tow plane.
Whassamattah? Did you fucking geniuses discover that when you used a weak link roughly equivalent to the force required to break the tow mast breakaway that the tow mast breakaway would break away at roughly the same percentage of times the weak link would break? (Who did you fucking geniuses have on that team who was smart enough to know how to spell BRIDLE? It sure as hell wasn't either you or Russell.)
The weak link is placed in the top of a V-bridal which would yield a maximum nominal towline tension of around 780#.
But what if we're at a flight park that uses a de jure, de facto, or actual value? What good is that gonna do us?
However, due to the fact the knots (two are required since there are three strands) are not "buried" the maximum towline tension is greatly reduced.
What's it matter? You've already invented an optimized wheel. Twice in fact - first with four strands and later with three.
I do not know the exact tow line tension required to break this weak link...
Or have the slightest fucking clue as to approximate towline tensions required to break ANY of these highly tuned weak links in any part of your system. So obviously none of the fucking morons you douchebags train and certify have the slightest fucking clue either. And so it gets argued about for decades while you sit back on your stupid sleazy criminally negligent ass and watch all the argumentative pilots in quiet amusement without allowing yourself to be drawn into the debates while your proven system that works crashes, cripples, kills people left and right.
...but the value is somewhat moot since the weak link is not too strong so as to cause any damage to the tow plane...
Fuck no. You've got the tow plane REALLY well protected by pre damaging one of the parts critical to the glider's safety and then dumbing down the original weak link to protect the pre damaged part from getting any more damaged.
...and it is not too weak to leave the glider pilot with the towline.
- Which glider pilot? The:
-- muppet with standard aerotow inconveniencer enforced by Davis and Rooney?
-- best of the best / 325 pound hook-in Sport 2 175 pilot who flies a three strand 200 stronglink
-- tandem pilot with a four strand 130 that your idiot clusterfuck of a system was supposed to be designed to handle?
- Is getting left with the towline the only concern here? Somewhere I got the impression that...
http://www.ushpa.aero/advisory.asp?id=1
USHPA - Safety Advisory #1
USHGA - 2006/03/15
Safety Notice
HG Tandem Aerotow Operations
It was noticed over a number of years there have been a number of fatalities to participants in hang glider aerotow instruction. The president of the USHPA, therefore, formed an Ad Hoc Joint Committee of the chairs of Safety and Training, Tandem and Towing to investigate this, appointing the Chair of Safety and Training to preside. Tandem instructors Matt Taber and David Glover were invited to participate.
This committee reviewed a number of possible causes for aerotow tandem fatalities. One particular possible cause stood out as predominate. This was the common belief that when a glider gets low on tow the pilot can safely push out and let the glider climb up to the level of the tow plane safely because the glider will not stall under tow.
This issue is so important that this committee and the towing committee have recommended that the following message be sent to all aerotow pilots and all Aero-Tug pilots with a particular emphasis to aerotow tandem pilots.
Experiences in hang glider tandem flight using aero-tow launch along with analysis of accidents and incidents that have occurred during such flight strongly suggest, for safety reasons, the following cautions be observed.
If the pilot of the tandem glider finds that he/she is too low behind the tug and slow enough that the glider will not climb without pushing out pass trim, then the pilot should pull in and release rather than trying to push out and climb to the tug altitude. Though pushing out to climb to the tug altitude has been a common practice usually accomplished without incident, there is a deep underlying danger in doing this. Should the tandem glider become unattached from the tug during this maneuver, the nose high attitude of the tandem glider attained while doing this will cause a very abrupt stall which will result in a much greater altitude loss than one would expect (possibly more than 750 feet). The most extreme cases may result in structural failure of the glider.
Towing tandems requires extra awareness on the part of the tug pilots, particularly in the early part of the tow to help the tandem pilot avoid the development of critical situations. Prior to the start of the tow, proper tow speeds based on the gross weight of the tandem glider should be determined. Greater total weight will require correspondingly higher tow speeds. It is CRITICAL to understand that the towed hang glider is at risk when the tow is slow and the glider is low. When towing a tandem glider, the tug pilot should fly the appropriate airspeed to keep the tandem glider in the proper position and if there is any doubt the tug pilot should fly slightly faster and avoid flying slightly slow. The tug pilot should avoid pulling up abruptly and leaving the tandem glider low. If the glider is low on tow, the tug pilot should attempt to speed up and to descend to the altitude of the towed glider, releasing the tow rope only as a last resort.
These points are crucial to the safety of aerotow tandem flight. However, this letter is addressed to all aerotow rated pilots and tug pilots, not just to tandem pilots. This is because in consulting with pilots about this issue, we found that this problem is exhibited under the same circumstances with solo gliders as well. Because of the lighter wing loading of the solo gliders, the reaction of a solo glider is not as severe, but can still be violent.
To insure that all AT rated tandem pilots are notified, we are asking that the AT-rated tandem pilots sign on to the USHPA web site (
http://www.ushga.org) and fill out a form that states that they have read and understand the safety notice. If you are an AT-rated tandem pilot and do not have computer access (i.e. no email address) you will be sent the form to fill out and sign, and a USHPA addressed, stamped envelope. Understand that we are not asking if you agree with the safety notice, but that you have read it and understand what it says. You will need to do this in order to have your tandem rating renewed.
Flying with a tandem passenger is a special privilege which the FAA allows us to grant to qualified pilots. These pilots are supposed to be highly skilled. We expect tandem flights to be safer than solo flights, not more dangerous. Safety records do not currently seem to support this expectation. We expect tandem flights under the rules of the USHPA to be conducted in such a way that this expectation is realized.
David G. Broyles, Chairman of Safety and Training Committee
Steve Kroop, Chairman of Tow Committee
Paul Voight, Chairman of Tandem Committee
...should a tandem glider "become unattached" from the tug under certain circumstances which seem to occur at frighteningly high frequencies a very abrupt stall could result in a much greater altitude loss than one would expect (possibly more than 750 feet).
Would it really matter that much in such a situation which pilot was left with the towline?
Well...
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=31052
Poll on weaklinks
Jim Rooney - 2013/03/04 09:25:48 UTC
I'd suspect what you actually read was that I've got an itchy trigger finger. I don't know that I've passed out that many ropes really. I can probably think of all/most of the ones I've given.
It's a pain in the ass btw. If I drop my rope, I have to go get it... which means I'm not towing again for a while... and who knows where you're going to leave it.
So thankfully it's not too common.
It would be a real pain in the ass for the tuggie to recover his towline...
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=865
Tandem pilot and passenger death
Mike Van Kuiken - 2005/10/13 19:47:26 UTC
The weak link broke from the tow plane side. The towline was found underneath the wreck, and attached to the glider by the weaklink. The glider basically fell on the towline.
...from all that mess. Best dumb the back end weak links a little more to protect the front end weak link which protects the pre damaged to mast from being damaged any more. We certainly wouldn't want a tuggie to suffer any unnecessary inconvenience.
Summary
Do not attempt to aerotow unless you have received proper training
- From somebody like THIS?:
25-23223
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3713/9655904048_89cce6423a_o.png
- Do we also need to have proper equipment or can we fly with the totally useless cheap shit that Quest sells? No, wait...
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TUGS/message/1149
aerotow instruction was Re: Tug Rates
Tracy Tillman - 2011/02/10 20:08:32 UTC
Hey Tad.
Anybody who is truly a good pilot, in any form of aviation, knows that the knowledge, skills, and judgement you have in your head, learned from thorough instruction from a good instructor with a good curriculum, are the best pieces of equipment you can fly with. Good equipment is important, the best equipment is a well-trained brain.
I guess we're OK with well-trained brains. And for just a few hundred bucks extra we can get one of those in the course of a couple tandem Cone of Safety instructional flights.
- Who the fuck do you know who's "attempting to aerotow" without having received "proper" Flight Park Mafia training?
Do not attend an aerotow comp if you do not have considerable experience flying a comp class glider in comp class conditions
Yeah...
http://www.chgpa.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=3391
More on Zapata and weak link
Paul Tjaden - 2008/07/22 04:32:22 UTC
The lockout Lauren mentioned was precipitated by my attempt to pull on more VG while on tow. I have done this before but this time the line wouldn't cleat properly and while I was fighting it, I got clobbered and rolled hard right in a split second. There was a very large noise and jerk as the relatively heavy weak link at the tug broke giving me the rope. I recovered quickly from the wingover and flew back to the field to drop the line and then relaunched after changing to a normal weak link. I have never had a lockout situation happen so quickly and dramatically and had no chance to release as I have always thought I could do. Had the tug's link not broken, things could have gotten very ugly very fast. I still don't like weak links breaking when they shouldn't, but the one I was using was way too strong.
We can't have just any ol' douchebag fucking around behind a valuable Dragonfly on a comp class glider in comp class conditions with a thumb up his ass - specially flying one of those deadly Tad-O-Links that should be reserved for the best of the best.
Weak links are there to protect the equipment
OK. So...
Collectively I would say that there have been well over a 100,000 tows in the various US flight parks using the same strength weak link with tens of thousands of these tows being in competition.
After well over a hundred thousand tows in the various US flight parks you found that if you went up from the single loop standard aerotow inconveniencer for solos and the double loop standard aerotow inconveniencer for tandems you started seeing equipment damage. So how much of this damage was severe enough to knock a plane out of the sky - and where can we go to read the reports?
And only the best of the best aerotow pilots - the four hundred pounders - are allowed to use stronglinks 'cause they're all good enough to keep their gliders under enough control to avoid breaking a plane. So if they DON'T keep things together their stronglinks are gonna break a plane. So what's the point of having ANY weak link? What's it matter if you break the plane with two Gs or six? If your parachute can't open in less than two hundred feet what's it matter if the cliff you're running unhooked off of is 80 feet or 180?
Weak links do NOT prevent lockouts and no amount of weak link rules will prevent lock outs
So rules like these:
http://ozreport.com/12.081
Weaklinks - the HGFA rules
Davis Straub - 2008/04/22 14:47:00 UTC
Pilots must use weaklinks provided by the meet organizers and in a manner approved by the meet organizers. All weaklinks will be checked and use of inappropriate weaklinks will require the pilot to go to the end of the launch line to change the weaklink.
Weaklinks will consist of a single loop of Cortland 130 lb. Greenspot braided Dacron Tolling line and should be placed at one end of a shoulder bridle.
...are strictly to prevent gliders certified to over six Gs from being broken up on tow. These inappropriate weak links Davis is protecting everybody from are capable of tearing the wings off the glider.
In the event of a lock out releases are there...
Where? Within...
Paul Tjaden - 2008/07/22 04:32:22 UTC
I have never had a lockout situation happen so quickly and dramatically and had no chance to release as I have always thought I could do.
...easy reach? Lemme ask ya sumpin', motherfucker... Do you read discussions like THIS:
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=21033
barrels release without any tension except weight of rope..
Bart Weghorst - 2011/02/25 19:06:26 UTC
I've had it once where the pin had bent inside the barrel from excessive tow force. My weaklink was still intact. The tug pilot's weaklink broke so I had the rope. I had to use two hands to get the pin out of the barrel.
No stress because I was high.
...with the same quiet amusement you do when you read about people getting demolished and killed by Rooney Link pops?
...to save the pilot
Really? Davis's comments are dead on, weak links are there to protect the equipment and do NOT prevent lockouts, and in the event of a lockout releases are there to save the pilot but...
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=31052
Poll on weaklinks
Davis Straub - 2013/03/06 18:29:05 UTC
You know, after all this discussion I'm now convinced that it is a very good idea to treat the weaklink as a release, that that is exactly what we do when we have a weaklink on one side of a pro tow bridle. That that is exactly what has happened to me in a number of situations and that the whole business about a weaklink only for the glider not breaking isn't really the case nor a good idea for hang gliding.
...Davis is gonna continue mandating weak link rules which put pretty much all gliders up on the most dangerous weak links conceivable to use as lockout protectors / instant hands free releases?
Best regards, Steve - Flytec USA
Suck my dick, Steve - Flytec USA. I've got a list of hang gliding people I'd bend over to stop from bleeding to death, it's REALLY SHORT, and YOU'RE NOT ON IT.
I think all these landmark bullshit posts, articles, books...
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/skysailingtowing/message/4633
Weaklinks and aerotowing (ONLY)
http://www.wallaby.com/aerotow_primer.php
Aerotow Primer for Experienced Pilots
http://ozreport.com/12.081
Weaklinks - the HGFA rules
HIGHER EDUCATION - 2012/06
TIE A (BETTER) WEAK LINK
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/skysailingtowing/message/4633
Weaklinks and aerotowing (ONLY)
...are all composed by the same ghostwriting asshole. They all say EXACTLY the same things:
- We decided that a single loop of 130 pound Greenspot put all solo gliders at precisely 1.0 Gs - which is a good rule of thumb for a lockout and stall preventer.
- The strength of this weak link in pounds is whatever the fuck we feel like saying it is at any given moment.
- If you:
-- want something stronger hide the knot better - you can get twice the consistency but the same lockout and stall protection 'cause it's still 130 pound Greenspot.
-- would rather use 200 and keep tying it so that breaks inconsistently you're a despicable asshole who's a threat to himself and has no regard whatsoever for the life of the tug pilot.
- If your own test results reveal something other than what we feel like saying at any given moment you can go fuck yourself..
- If you can't handle the instantaneous loss of a couple hundred pounds of thrust under any circumstances you:
-- had failed to keep the nose down low enough
-- didn't get enough tandem training
-- need to learn how to land
-- are a faggot who needs to find an alternate activity more compatible with his testosterone level - like checkers
- If one of OUR guys couldn't handle the instantaneous loss of a couple hundred pounds of thrust at the worst possible time, when he was climbing hard in a near stall situation:
-- no one will ever really know what happened
-- you weren't there so you couldn't possibly know what happened - the guys who were there don't even know what happened
-- stop speculating - it's disgusting
-- go fuck yourself
- What FAA aerotowing regulations?
- Anyone who's found dead on a runway with a broken Rooney Link after a lockout made no effort to make the easy reach to his release actuator.
- We're all in agreement about everything, we're never gonna admit to having been wrong about anything, if you don't like it then you can go to the flight park Tad runs. And, while you're there, ask him why he was banned from every aerotow operation on the continent.
If I can get to 240 (which I have done twice before) and stay there for three months, Sarah said she'll get a Brazilian. 
All kinds of incentives!
