Weak links

General discussion about the sport of hang gliding
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: Weak links

Post by Tad Eareckson »

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=31867
Hang gliding accident in Forbes:
Dave Pendzick - 2014/09/24 20:04:57 UTC

DAMN... That sucks. I wonder what happened? Maybe a dust devil or something...
Yeah. Like at Quest on 2013/02/02. Not much you can do about dust devils - 'specially those invisible ones like the one that got Zack. Probably using one of those new two hundred pound stronglinks that many of us are now using and Davis is happy with. We shoulda listened to Jim Keen-Intellect Rooney. Now there's one more pilot he'll hafta visit in the hospital.

Well, we should get a good report on this in a few days. That's generally about how long it takes to round up and swallow all the video cards and work up some kind of story that everyone can stick to.
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<BS>
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Re: Weak links

Post by <BS> »

(How the fracture piece managed to blow at the precise instant the release was blown I have no fuckin' clue. Any ideas?)
The pilot's timing was perfect, everything was appropriate.
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: Weak links

Post by Tad Eareckson »

Yeah, I shouldn't have been surprised. The standard aerotow fracture piece has proven to be so effective at so much in the way of critical decision making ability that something as simple as dumping the glider off at the agreed upon altitude would be a total no brainer.
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: Weak links

Post by Tad Eareckson »

http://www.forbesadvocate.com.au/story/2581947/hang-gliding-accident/?cs=4096
Hang gliding accident in Forbes
Renee Powell - 2014/09/24 14:15

A man was airlifted to Westmead Hospital with head injuries after a hang gliding accident at Forbes aerodrome on Tuesday afternoon.

It appears the man, who is from Sydney, was being towed up by a light aircraft but shortly after he left the launching trolley he crashed back to the ground.

Ambulances were called to the site and transported the man to Eugowra showground, where he was picked up by helicopter and taken to Sydney.

Ambulance media officers said his condition had been stabilised but he was suffering serious injuries including to his head and face.

Police believe the man, in his 30s, was an inexperienced hang glider but they have not been able to clarify exactly what went amiss on launching.

More to come.
Information is being sat on. There are people who know exactly what happened who very conspicuously aren't saying anything. They're in damage control mode.

So what's the most common cause of crashes on aerotow launch?

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24846
Is this a joke ?
Jim Rooney - 2011/09/02 23:09:12 UTC

Yeah, damn those pesky safety devices!
Remember kids, always blame the equipment.
This guy has very likely mushed his brain and done serious permanent damage. Please, God, if that's the case, then let the cause have been what I think it was. Can't wait to hear all the Rooney Linkers talking and not talking about it.

And the longer we don't hear anything the more certain we can be about what happened. The increase in the safety of the towing operation happened East Aussie Tuesday afternoon and the Thursday sun just finished setting on the Indian Ocean off the west edge of the continent. That's many internet eternities.
Jim Rooney - 2011/09/02 19:41:27 UTC

Why is the devil always in the fine print, and incidentally in the things people *don't* say.

Yes, go read that incident report.
Please note that the weaklink *saved* her ass. She still piled into the earth despite the weaklink helping her... for the same reason it had to help... lack of towing ability. She sat on the cart, like so many people insist on doing, and took to the air at Mach 5.
That never goes well.
Yet people insist on doing it.

Your tandem incident was some guy trying to drag himself out of a low lockout instead of accepting the fact that he was too far out of position and hitting the damn release, pulling the nose in and flying away.

Those "other factors" just happen to be *the* factors.
You can't look *for* facts to backup your opinion.
That's just bs arguing.

You have to look at facts and find what they tell you.
It doesn't work the other way around.
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: Weak links

Post by Tad Eareckson »

And/Or this guy was an unqualified student type.

Friday is pretty much over in Sydney and we haven't heard a single peep from anybody in hang gliding, anything outside of that one news media report. And, aside from Yours Truly, we haven't heard a single peep about there not having been a single peep.

I now think it's highly likely this guy WAS an unqualified student type - otherwise the people involved would have some grounds for the "pilot error" write-off and would be screaming it at the top of their lungs.

One thing we know fer sure... The focal point of their safe towing system did its usual shit job of increasing the safety of the towing operation. Ditto for the douchebag tug driver with respect to fixing whatever was going on back there by giving him the rope.
Steve Davy
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Re: Weak links

Post by Steve Davy »

Ray Hadley: Thanks after hang gliding accident - audio player

https://www.2gb.com/audioplayer/65656#.VCWp5WddWOA
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: Weak links

Post by Tad Eareckson »

https://www.2gb.com/audioplayer/65656#.VCWp5WddWOA
Ray Hadley: Thanks after hang gliding accident - audio

Tino, g'day.
G'day, Ray. How are you?
Well, thank you Tino.
Ray, I'm ringing about my son that, uh, Steven, that was critically injured in a hang glider accident last Tuesday, at Forbes. And uh...
Forbes... Uh, OK, um, I think I may have mentioned this, hang gliding incident on the twenty-fourth (third). Would that be it?
That's it.
And he's from Sydney and uh... Dear oh dear.
Yeah. What I was ringing for, Ray is uh... You know... We're all quick to criticize and condemn. But we're very short on the ability to praise when something, uh, when you see something go into action. And particularly I rang... I heard about it on... six o'clock on, uh, Tuesday, uh, night. And, uh, I rang triple 0, they put me through to Parks LAC, the lady at Parks LAC got hold of the attending constable at Forbes, and they let me know what was going on. And, uh, just to, to see the whole system going into action, and getting to Westmead by helicopter and down into the hospital... I just want to thank everyone involved.
Did, did, did you become aware very quickly, did you, Tino, that this was your boy?
Yeah, about six o'clock.
OK. And he's a very experienced hang glider, I'm told.
No, he's, you know, he's going through a course with hang gliding and he's done a little bit hang gliding. This was part of the course where they're towed up by, uh, an ultralight. He lost control at about six meters and plunged into the ground.
Oh dear. And what condition is he now in, ol' mate?
Um... It... It appears that his survival's fine, he's AOK.
Right.
It appears that he hasn't had his... uh, too much brain damage at all, so that looks all positive.
Yeah.
And, uh, you know, he's got a few broken bones and things of that nature. It appears they'll take him off the, um, ventilator system probably today or tomorrow. Uh, they've fixed his broken bones on his arms and --- on his wrists and then they're uh... Uh... They hope to do any of the facial injuries sometime, you know, next week maybe.
What's your boy's first name?
Steven.
Steven. He's 34 I'm told.
Yes.
OK. Well, things are looking much brighter on this Friday than they were
on Tuesday, Wednesday, by the sound of it.
No, I think you're a hundred percent right. But importantly, you know, those people that are involved, I mean... We've got a system that's probably second to none in the world.
Mm. Mm.
Once they go into coordinated action they tend to get it done very well - particularly the people at Westmead and the police force.
Yeah, I did actually mention it - Eugowra, showgrounds. He was picked up by chopper...
That's where they picked him up from.
Yeah, um, OK. And he, he's actually, yeah, I, I thought I'd said that he was experienced but actually he was learning to be a hang glider pilot, so to speak.
That's right, he was going through a particular phase of the instruction
and this one was being towed up by a... uh... an ultralight specifically designed for that exercise. I think it was up at Bill Moyes's property up there. And uh, uh, you know, unfortunately, accidents happen ---
They do.
And, uh, he's lucky to be alive.
Well, that's very kind of you to let us know, uh, what's happened and also kind of you to thank the emergency services. Can... Can I ask you to do me one favor? Can you let me know how Steven progresses because everyone will be very interested to make sure that he makes, uh, as good a recovery as he possibly can, given the expertise of the people involved.
Yes, it's awesome to watch them in operation down there in operation at Westmead Hospital.
Good on ya, mate. Well, you hold it together and you're a nice man for ringing and thanking those people when you're going through a difficult time with your son.
Uh... Thanks Ray.
Thanks Tino. That's very kind of you. And we wish Steven all the very very best. I've got a lovely note from a gentleman in Gulgong:
"Good morning, Ray. I was listening to your program this morning. I heard that you were going to be with the dad of the young man that was injured at Forbes in that incident last Tuesday the twenty-second (third) of the month. I'm the inspector in the ambulance service that was on duty in charge of the treatment and evacuation of the young man. I'm more than happy to discuss with the dad any questions he may have in relation to it. It was wonderful to hear he's doing well. We don't get a lot of feedback because of privacy regulations."
Well, look... Dad's really happy with what you did and we're more than happy to pass your details on. But I think you'll find he just wanted to come on here and thank all of you people, including you, inspector, for the wonderful, the wonderful, uh, work you did in relation to his son.
MikeLake
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Re: Weak links

Post by MikeLake »

Tad Eareckson wrote:... And, aside from Yours Truly, we haven't heard a single peep about there not having been a single peep.
Be assured it hasn't gone unnoticed!
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: Weak links

Post by Tad Eareckson »

I'm quite assured. Also quite assured that all the folk with any involvement in this one are wanting it to go as unnoticed as possible by as many people as possible.

Devastating, near fatal, student AT lockout crash Tuesday afternoon, it's now the beginning of Sunday in Sydney, and we've got NOTHING from those bastards. I don't think there's ever been anything like this before.
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: Weak links

Post by Tad Eareckson »

Let's call him Steven Tinoson.

He either wasn't taught shit about roll control and drifted into a lockout or controlled roll too well because of the enhanced responsiveness that comes with towing and oscillated himself into a lockout or to the point at which he had failed to maintain the correct tow position (centered, with the wheels of the tug on the horizon), and the:
- Davis Link broke before he could get into too much trouble, increasing the safety of the towing operation; or
- tug pilot made a good decision in the interest of his safety and fixed whatever was going on back there by giving him the rope

There is no evidence that Steve made an attempt to make the easy reach to the downtube mounted brake lever prior to separation - the gate was found closed on his Wallaby-style tow release.

Maybe:
- thought he could fix a bad thing and didn't wanna start over
- just froze
- didn't realize that a Davis Link isn't such a great lockout protector below 250 feet - as we know from Marc Fink's experience

Whatever happened on this one reveals a ton of declarations we've had from the Aerotow Industry as the total load of shit that it is - just like with Zack Marzec.

I think we've already gotten as much solid information as we're gonna get on this one - unless there's a lawsuit. Still might be a problem as I doubt Steven will have any more recollection of his crash than Holly does of hers.
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