The Bob Show

[Tad Eareckson]

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1577
hangglider

Tom Sines - 2014/07/24 13:13:24 UTC

Hi Bob, I do appreciate the warnings. When I learned to fly, I had enough close calls to know flying is dangerous!

You didn't learn shit then.

You should be scared of flying when you start 'cause you're not wired in, a lot of it's counterintuitive, and instruction generally sucks.

You have close calls because you do stupid shit. That shouldn't teach that flying is dangerous, that should teach you that doing stupid shit is dangerous.

I have no intention of building some strange device, and jump off a cliff to see if it works.

You mean like all those brave individuals referenced by Rick and Bob whose sacrifices made the safety we enjoy today possible? Aw, c'mon... Just one strange device and one experimental cliff jump. What's the worst that could happen?

I'm a very slow methodical inventor, I calculate every risk carefully. Also, I have been following the progress of hanggliders for years.

Well then you should know that "hang glider" is two words. I don't get too bent out of shape when people invent compound words - I do "sidewire" all the time myself - because our sport is young and has rapidly evolved and we need language to evolve with it to some extent but "hangglider" kinda sucks and it's never gonna become mainstream and it never should.

And you should also know that hang gliders pretty much stopped making forward progress of any significance in 1979 and mostly went into reverse.

I know they are dangerous.

Bullshit. NOBODY's crashing because hang gliders are dangerous. They crash because they do stupid and totally unnecessary bullshit with them. The absolute LAST thing I worry about when I go up is crashing because my glider's dangerous. They have their limitations, as do all aircraft, some pretty major but we can EASILY allow and compensate for them.

One of the things I hope to do is make them less dangerous.

About the only thing you can do to do that is stick a tail on them to make them more tumble resistant. But you won't be the first person to have thought of that or done it. And tumbling gliders isn't a statistically significant issue in the sport. And we can pretty easily address that issue by not pushing our luck in really nasty air. And when you start adding tails to hang gliders they start drifting a bit from the concept of a hang glider. And I'm not terribly interested - got along just fine for over a quarter century through a wide range of conditions without ever needing or wanting one.

Wanna do massive bang for the buck / pick off bushels of low hanging fruit? Work on light clean wheels or skids and skiddable harnesses. After you get that done then come talk to me.

So, let me ask you again, for a slow flying fixed wing hangglider, what is the approximate balance point along the cord of the wing?

I dunno... or care. Nobody's ever gonna improve on the handling, performance, engineering of what we plateaued at years ago.

Remember the horse and buggy days, they thought they had the ultimate form of transportation, then along came Henry Ford.

And we tore up all the train and trolley tracks, paved over everything in sight, and started roasting the planet we'd had for hundreds of millions of years out of existence. Hallelujah! Praise be to Jesus!

You're not gonna do anything positive for hang gliding. If you had been following hang gliding for years, were interested in enhancing safety and addressing issues, and had a functional brain then The Bob Show would be about the last place you'd be logged on and talking. There are even a few tiny pockets of The Jack Show where you'd be better off.

[Tad Eareckson]

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1
Hello US Hawks!!

Hey Bob...

Bob Kuczewski - 2010/08/13 21:40:09 UTC

The US Hawks Hang Gliding Association is being founded to give pilots yet another choice in national organizations.

This topic was started on Friday August 13th, 2010, and it's intended to be a topic where new members can say "Hi" to introduce themselves.

So if you're a new member of the US Hawks, please make a post to this topic telling us about yourself. And if you have any problems, please feel free to send me a "personal message" (PM) or give me a call at 858-204-7499.

Thanks,
Bob Kuczewski

Allow me the honor of being the first to wish you yet another Happy Birthday!

Four years, 1461 days. That's Fort Sumter to Appomattox plus three, to Ford's Theatre minus one.

So tell me what YOU'VE accomplished inside of that span. Really good kill rate when you look at your most active core participants but you solved that problem by declaring stalls to be harmless and fun after you've practiced them a bit, mastered them.

Is there a Board of Directors for the US Hawks?

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/faq.php
Frequently Asked Questions

Is there a Board of Directors for the US Hawks?
Not yet. The HGAA's early problems arose because different people wanted to take the organization in different directions. That created power stuggles which cost the HGAA some of its early leadership. For now, I'm going to take the US Hawks in the direction that I believe is right. If people want to go along, then they're welcome. If not, there are at least two other alternatives.

Not yet. Still. Not one millimeter's worth of movement in that direction. Just as I predicted on your last two birthdays and predict now for all future ones. Always was "Love Bob or leave it.", always will be. When a con man / control freak starts an "organization" on a foundation of obvious and outrageous lies there really isn't any other possibility.

Opposite end of the spectrum over here, Bob.

I've NEVER wanted to be a dictator or have the survival of Kite Strings dependent upon Yours Truly.

- This was founded as an organization for PILOTS (with airtime from zero on up) who want to understand our flavor of aviation based upon the theory established by Sir Isaac and Wilbur and Orville. Since all of that stuff is immune to and lethally intolerant of varying opinions ALL aviators WILL end up on EXACTLY the same pages.

- But I've needed to have control of a ban button to keep and kick spammers, scammers, saboteurs, parasites, religious zealots, assholes with opinions out. Only times I've needed to use the ban button on anything other than spammers were for you - WAY too late), Sam - who was in only in ill considered deference to you, and your buddy OP - another lying total piece of shit who registered with the sole intent of being banned and rising up the USHGA power ladder for his pathetic backfiring sabotage efforts.

- Also... Zack has always, until a couple months ago when he was able to flip a switch, had more control authority than I've had. And at that time I/we bumped Steve up to Moderator status. And Steve's got my password. And I've offered to bump up all other significant participants to Moderator status but so far nobody's taken me up on it. And I'm guessing that's 'cause:
-- they trust me to:
--- always try to do the right thing and admit and correct mistakes
--- never use sabotage to win a conflict
-- we're all on the same page with two plus two equals four and thus stalls are regarded as BAD things

So I can get hit by a truck tomorrow and, while that would be a bitch 'cause, as of this one, I've got 3.069 times as many posts as those of all others combined, it wouldn't be a TOTAL disaster for Kite Strings because I:
- have people I TRUST who have the keys to keep things running for themselves and others (compare/contrast Jack and you)
- created an archive of:
-- solid information on anything you wanna name pertaining to conducting hang gliding in a safe, competent, efficient manner
-- debunktion of all the frauds, thieves, liars, sociopaths, serial killers who've been running hang gliding into the ground for decades

So what happens if/when you get hit by a truck? What happens to The Bob Show and your fraud of an "association" and how will you not have left hang gliding - along with the planet - worse off than it was when you found it?

[Tad Eareckson]

Bob Kuczewski - 2011/12/31 07:34:26 UTC

But if you want to talk numbers and logic, then start by explaining the laws of physics in terms of differential equations and not your simple 2+2=4 "logic" if you want my respect. Go ahead and explain the first quarter of Newtonian physics for us and see how far you get. We'll let you work your way up to the Navier-Stokes equations.

Wanna talk simple 2+2=4 "logic", motherfucker?

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=822
US Hawks Hook-In Verification Poll

Sam Kellner - 2011/11/07 03:31:00 UTC

For everyone who obsesses over being hooked in or not, get a flippin rear view mirror and attach it under the nose plate,
simple enough.

Bob Kuczewski - 2011/11/07 05:42:59 UTC

Sam, you are quite a genius!!

You tell every individual who comes to your forum and has a pulse what an outstanding and truly remarkable person he is. You tell a total vegetable like Sam who couldn't do simple 2+2=4 logic with a gun to his head - even if you could find somebody capable of resisting the urge to pull the trigger for five or ten minutes - that he's quite a genius!!

Then you tell me, the guy who blew physics professor Donnell Hewett's Skyting "Theory" out of the water while you Aeronautical/Astronautical Engineer douchebags were content to watch it killing people decade after decade, that if I can't run the calculus to prove what a harmless phenomenon a stall is then you have no respect for me.

And this is in a sport in which less than one percent of the participants are capapble of understanding that:

- a 250 foot length of Spectra behind a Dragonfly is physically incapable of transmitting pressure to a glider

- towing up on a piece of fishing line that dumps in-position gliders into stalls every fourth tow does not increase the safety of the towing operation

- just prior to launch does not mean five minutes ago in the staging area

So you're saying that you have respect for virtually no one in the sport, including, very obviously, your Bob Show lunatic colony. And if you have one or two people capable of doing the math, that stinks even more 'cause they're saying nothing when Davis, Rooney, Trisa are telling everybody that what happened with Zack Marzec is a total mystery and Bill and you are talking about what good clean fun stalls are.

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/faq.php
Frequently Asked Questions

Is there a Board of Directors for the US Hawks?
Not yet. The HGAA's early problems arose because different people wanted to take the organization in different directions. That created power stuggles which cost the HGAA some of its early leadership. For now, I'm going to take the US Hawks in the direction that I believe is right. If people want to go along, then they're welcome. If not, there are at least two other alternatives.

And then you're perpetually implying that somewhere not far around the corner you're gonna turn over control to establish a Board of Directors and have The Bob Show operate democratically.

You're gonna do this while you have zero respect for any of the individuals who might be candidates for power sharing roles or transitional control. Logical impossibility, Bob.

Due Process for Pilots - Mike Jefferson Case
http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=683

Bob Kuczewski - 2011/07/19 02:53:33 UTC

The same has been true of Sam Kellner (one of our best members by the way) and many other people that you've denigrated.

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=802
AL's Second flight at Packsaddle how it went

Bob Kuczewski - 2011/10/19 02:22:47 UTC

P.S. I might vote for Sam if he ever wants to run the US Hawks.

Yeah. He'd be one of your top candidates 'cause of the deep respect you have for him on account of his exceptionally keen intellect.

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=883
What will keep the US Hawks from becoming another USHPA or HGAA?

Bob Kuczewski - 2012/03/14 15:15:03 UTC

We can keep from becoming another HGAA by moving toward a Board of Directors to make decisions. The HGAA imploded because one person (Jack/SG) could do whatever he wanted on the forum with no accountability. Right now the US Hawks isn't much different. It's just one dictator (me) in place of another (Jack).

Always will be, Bob.

[Tad Eareckson]

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1577
hangglider

Tom Sines - 2014/08/11 10:30:41 UTC

While I'm waiting for an answer to my hangglider question here's a question for you all. Why are you still driving those smelly gas cars, haven't you had enough carbon monoxide yet?

It's the carbon DIoxide we need to be worrying about.

Rick Masters - 2014/08/13 01:59:22 UTC

Is there a real alternative?

I didn't think you were really all that much into alternatives, Rick.

Tom Sines - 2014/08/13 11:01:19 UTC

Hi Rick, You make a good point.
The choices are not very good, to expensive, no range, they even catch on fire, but at least there is a choice. You probably think I'm going to try and sell you my car, well it's not for sale. People like yourself just think I'm nuts, even though I have solved these problems. By the way, did you notice that brown haze over your city? I guess if you live in manure you get used to it. Go solar.

Bob Kuczewski - 2014/08/14 17:46:44 UTC

Objection. Assumes facts not in evidence.

Like global warming. And stalls being DANGEROUS.

Be nice!!

Yeah Tom. Are you too fuckin' stupid to understand that when Bob says:

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/faq.php
Frequently Asked Questions

If you see something that's not being done correctly, then it's your duty to speak out. One big difference between the US Hawks and other organizations is that the US Hawks really does honor the free speech of its members.

that he means free speech in line with his religious beliefs that doesn't rub any of his supporters the wrong way?

Rick Masters - 2014/08/14 21:08:22 UTC

Tom is referring to pollution and he is correct. This is something we have to explain to people from San Diego.

Fuck you, Rick. Assumes facts not in evidence.

Tom Sines - 2014/08/15 11:37:11 UTC

Hi Bob, I've Talked nice about pollution for decades, nobody paid attention. Now, America is circling the drain, and you're asleep at the wheel.

1. What planet are you from? This one's circling the drain - not just one relatively small red, white, and blue chunk of it.

2. Talking NICE...

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=992
Continuing Saga of Weak Link and Release Mechanism Failures

Warren Narron - 2012/03/06 02:26:04 UTC

Tad, used to post about as nice as anyone, and nicer than some. Remember?

Blowback... You put in a thousand plus hour$, tooling, te$ting and documenting safety issues for the masses and have it ignored and suppressed by people, for whatever reason, and you would get testy too.
You're fairly snarky as it is, and you haven't done the work...

...is a total waste of time when you're dealing with assholes.

3. Bob...

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=982
Anti-Christian Williams

Bob Kuczewski - 2012/05/09 17:43:17 UTC

The "sustainable growth" people like to carve humanity out from the rest of the eco system and give us the special responsibility to control our own growth. They forget that all species - human and non-human alike - are naturally inclined to overpopulate to the extent that they can do so. So it's part of their beloved Mother Nature's plan that there will always be species who discover new ways to grow and thrive.

From a purely objective view, the success of humanity in covering the planet is no different from the success of green plants in doing the same. After all, if they believe in evolution, then they must accept that there was a time when the earth was free of all that nasty ... chlorophyll. So while they claim to be objective in their criticism of humanity, they're really being hypocritical.

If they really believe in letting Mother Nature have her way, then they should recognize that humans are part of Mother Nature's system and we have just as much of a right to thrive - and even change the planet - as any other species has throughout history.

Now there are other arguments (actually human-centric arguments) for being careful about our growth. But those arguments would balance our human needs with the consequences of growth. Those arguments would have to include our own human needs (and desires) for things like: freedom, and property, and personal security, and personal risk, and even ... fun.

...doesn't give a flying fuck. And you don't hafta do a lot of research to realize that about him.

[Tad Eareckson]

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=463
Davis Straub's "Oz Report" Conflict of Interest

Bob Kuczewski - 2011/02/23 18:22:16 UTC

Tad,

I believe you're a brilliant fellow, and I'm happy to have you on this forum. Thanks for taking the time to post. I mean that very sincerely.

You don't want brilliant people on your forum any more than Capitol, Peter, Jack, Paragliding, Davis, Houston, Rocky Mountain do. Brilliant people are major threats to con men and the happy little communities of religious nut cases they cultivate.

But we may have some fundamental disagreements.

Goddam right and good.

There's nothing wrong with that, and I actually think it's great because it allows us to challenge each other and helps us hone our arguments.

And, fuck, when your arguments get demolished you can always decide you want The Bob Show to be a safe place for people of varying ages to visit and pull out your ban button.

But it does bring up the question of whether or not our goals are sufficiently aligned for us to actually work toward any shared results.

Not in a million years, Bob.

For example, I really believe that the US Hawks should be an organization that invites a full range of perspectives.

Especially the kind of moronic crap put forth by the likes of Rick, Bill, and Sam.

Those that stand up to the tests of time will bubble to the top, and those that are garbage will be exposed.

Sure Bob. Why would anyone want a straight pin release and 1.5 G Tad-O-Link when we've got bent pin releases and 130 pound Greenspot pitch and lockout protectors with amazingly long track records, proven systems that work?

Bullshit. There isn't a single goddam thing we do or use that requires a "test of time". Two plus two equals four and it doesn't matter how many of you fuckin' assholes vote for other outcomes or how many decades you do it. The last backup loop installed on a glider at Wills Wing is just as moronic as the first. Likewise with the shitheads who insist on them.

And you bloody well know that as well as I do. But you spew mumbo jumbo like that because it suits your political objectives. An evolutionary biologist will read that crap and think, "Well yeah. Obviously. Done deal." So will a Creationist. And you'll be able to play both sides forever.

That's how I believe we can best interface the human mind (which is prone to all sorts of self-deceptions) with the underlying physics of the universe (including Newton's laws).

Not interested in your BELIEFS - asshole. You BELIEVE that a stall is nothing to be feared and Sam is quite a genius!! Those beliefs got one of your guys killed.

The best way we can interface the human mind with the underlying physics of the universe is to keep all the defective ones the hell out of the decision making processes and any positions of authority and responsibility - same way things work in REAL aviation.

It's the scientific method applied to aviation by anyone with the intelligence and discipline to do so.

So what about the other 99.9 percent of the people who fly hang gliders? What happens to the Bille Floyds, Shannon Moons, John Sewards, Shane Smiths, Bryan Bowkers, Terry Masons, Zack Marzecs, Majo Gulartes?

How 'bout a Jeremiah Thompson who's just entering the sport and assuming that his Hang Four / AT administrator / Advanced Tandem Aerotow Instructor knows what the fuck he's doing and is adhering to existing regulations? Name some people in this sport who at that stage of training would've had a snowball's chance in hell of survival in Jeremiah's place. No fuckin' way I would've. No fuckin' way you would've...

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=811
FTHI

Bob Kuczewski - 2011/10/25 06:28:43 UTC

Joe knows far more about hang gliding than I probably ever will.

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=884
The Bob Show

Bob Kuczewski - 2011/12/13 05:55:39 UTC

I've had to deal with your profanity, your attacks on other members, your strong weak link theories, your lift and tug theories, and your hopelessly long and repetitive posts.

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1563
Platform Launching (PL) Draft suggestions needed

Bob Kuczewski - 2014/06/06 17:21:51 UTC

As forum moderator, I try to read every post on the forum. I know Tad has long pushed the "strong weak link" idea, and I'm glad to see the other side of the argument being presented.

I also like that this discussion emphasizes that breaking a weak link is something that can be practiced - just like we practice stalls - so we understand how to handle them and to not be afraid of them.

...times ten thousand.

I very much value experts, and I tend to highly endorse their advice.

Which is another way of saying that you're too fuckin' stupid to be able to understand what you're doing and talking about.

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=822
US Hawks Hook-In Verification Poll

Bob Kuczewski - 2011/11/13 00:58:28 UTC

Look, I'm not just relying on my opinion here. I've asked some of the experts and they have advised me that performing a "lift-and-tug" in difficult conditions can introduce significant risk to the pilot's safety. Until you can PROVE otherwise, you're just voicing what I would consider to be an uneducated opinion.

REAL pilots know that there's no such thing as a goddam "expert" in anything in this game and they don't take and endorse "advice". They work to thoroughly understand the issues to the extent that they can put that understanding to work in the air and are able to explain them to others such that they too have full practical understandings.

There are no "EXPERTS" on two plus two equals four. You either get it or you don't and if you don't you should probably consider another hobby.

But when we turn experts (who give advice) into kings (who mandate laws) we end up with USHPA.

Bullshit. Name some EXPERTS - in something hang gliding related other than promoting themselves as experts and fucking over the sport and the people in it - in USHGA.

We've already got USHPA. If you want USHPA-like control...

I don't. I want competent pilot control. Here at Kite Strings I'd trust any of the active participants on my crew, pulling me, being pulled by me, in office, writing policy, running the forum. They all view stalls as BAD things - not as inconveniences like Pagen, Paul and Lauren, Davis, Trisa, Rooney, Peter do nor as GOOD things like Bill and you do.

...then you should work within USHPA to get it or start another organization and declare yourself king. I might even join it ... if the price is right.

I'd love to have you, Bob, but I know you're much to busy running your dictatorship and constantly applying democracy lipstick.

But with US Hawks, I'm trying to do something different.

Just what aviation has always needed - Bob trying to do something different...

Bob Kuczewski - 2011/12/31 07:34:26 UTC

But if you want to talk numbers and logic, then start by explaining the laws of physics in terms of differential equations and not your simple 2+2=4 "logic" if you want my respect. Go ahead and explain the first quarter of Newtonian physics for us and see how far you get. We'll let you work your way up to the Navier-Stokes equations.

...with people for whom he has no respect...

I'm trying to build an organization where we use our wisdom (both individual and collective)...

...using their collective wisdom.

...to sift through the many options and continually choose the best path.

Yours.

What a total load of crap. You've been around for four years with this bullshit. Show me one single example of it functioning. Oh, right. We're basing our policy on the tests of time and time is infinite - just like the period in which you're preparing US Hawks for control by an elected Board of Directors. If a bent pin release welds itself shut at half weak link who's to say that it won't bubble up and start working just fine a hundred years from now?

That might be the "Tad Release" today and the "Rooney Improved Release" tomorrow.

Great choice for an example, Bob.

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30971
Zach Marzec

Jim Rooney - 2013/02/13 19:09:33 UTC

It was already worked out by the time I arrived.
The reason it sticks?
Trail and error.

You're right that physics hasn't changed, but our creativity and ability to use new ideas and materials is always evolving.

Backwards, motherfucker.

- When Paul Tjaden says:

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24534
It's a wrap

Paul Tjaden - 2011/07/30 15:33:54 UTC

Quest Air has been involved in perfecting aerotowing for nearly twenty years.

show me one single thing that isn't either the exact same shitrigged crap they were using twenty years ago or something three times crappier.

- When you say "our creativity and ability to use new ideas and materials is always evolving" you sound like a tobacco company executive itemizing the great strides we've made in reducing deaths from lung cancer and emphysema. You've never contributed a single goddam thing in the way of creativity, ability to use new ideas and materials. You're not even capable for grasping old solid ideas we had in the days before Donnell Hewett came along and decided to reinvent reality based upon all of his convenient assumptions.

- Don't you EVER use first person plural when there's the slightest chance of somebody interpreting it to include me.

We need an organization that can make room for that evolution and embrace it.

Same way Liberty University makes room for and embraces evolution.

That's why I started the HGAA, and that's why I started the US Hawks.

When Kite Strings was started it was TWO people and I was second in command.

I really enjoy the way you phrase things, and that's another reason I'm happy to have you on this forum.

Not so much anymore, huh Bob?

But I'm not against standards. In fact I'm a big advocate of standards.

Right. Whatever suits you at any given moment.

We should, for example, have standards for certified hang gliders. We should have standards for parachutes. We should have standards for certified tow releases. We should be able to say "these hang gliders, parachutes, and tow releases meet our standards". We should also be able to say "these hang gliders, parachutes, and tow releases DO NOT meet our standards". I'm very happy to say both of those things. But I'm not so happy to say "you can only use the equipment that meets our standards". I feel that's a step too far. Now when it comes to insurance and land use, it's perfectly reasonable for anyone to say that they will only support activities that meet a certain set of standards. For example, a club or flight park might require HGMA hang gliders and Eareckson releases, but tolerate a lower standard on parachutes.

Great, Bob. Name some people you know who want to be flying uncertified gliders and parachutes. Name some people you know who want to be flying uncertified...

miguel - 2012/05/31 22:57:42 UTC

The glider had a bicycle handle release. When it came time to release, it would not release and in fighting with it, it came loose on the downtube, rotating around it. Fighting with it put the glider in the beginnings of lockout so I flew the glider. I noticed that the truck had stopped but the reel was free wheeling. I had done step towing before so I flew large circles around the towline and landed into the wind. I kissed the ground and swore never to tow a hang glider again.

...releases. The only reason people fly crap...

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=22540
LMFP release dysfunction

Diev Hart - 2011/07/14 17:19:12 UTC

I have had issues with them releasing under load. So I don't try to release it under a lot of load now.

...is because that's all The Industry provides and allows into circulation. The "collective wisdom" of the douchebags who fly hang gliders is that Jim Keen-Intellect Rooney has a keen intellect and that if there were better options out there everybody would be using them already.

That may be going against the "officially recommended" US Hawks standards, but I would like to see us able to accommodate that if possible (although I recognize there may be practical problems with such an implementation).

So to summarize my position, I would like the US Hawks to make recommendations (which will hopefully become widely accepted and respected)...

Every bit is much as you are personally, Bob. 'Cause that's all US Hawks has been, is, ever will be - you pulling all the strings and pretending that people you allow to participate have voices in any decisions.

...but I would also like the US Hawks to be tolerant and supportive of the experimentation and innovation which are an integral part of the human spirit.

1. A and DO make sure you balance out all that toleration and support of the experimentation and innovation which are integral parts of the human spirit with a healthy dose of queer bashing. Let's not go totally nuts here.

2. Bullshit. Tell me about all the experimentation and innovation that's come out of The Bob Show in the span of its Civil War length history. THIS:

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=822
US Hawks Hook-In Verification Poll

Sam Kellner - 2011/11/07 03:31:00 UTC

For everyone who obsesses over being hooked in or not, get a flippin rear view mirror and attach it under the nose plate,
simple enough.

Bob Kuczewski - 2011/11/07 05:42:59 UTC

Sam, you are quite a genius!!

is the best any of you useless douchebags or ever gonna do. And going outside of The Bob Show western hang gliding culture is an experimentation / innovation desert that surpasses the planet Mars. After over a third of a century of Skyting Theory towing only about one in five thousand glider jockeys can conceive of a way to get off tow in an emergency beyond tying oneself to the towline using a piece of fishing line and hoping in breaks soon enough to allow recovery from a lockout from 250 feet and up.

Can you tell what's wrong with this:

17-11422
http://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8546/29432805605_c0c2c710bb_o.png


picture? Thousands of glider jockeys see thousands of pictures like that without batting an eye.

I'd like to hear your goals for the US Hawks as well.

I wanna see it totally demolished - along with all the other cancers in the sport.

Maybe we can find a way to work together (and maybe not).

Probably not.

I hope so because I appreciate what you bring to the table.

A suggestion to have your head stuck on a pike next to Sam's?

It's interesting to note that in the playground of evolution, there are no standards other than what works best.

And after they've spent millions of years figuring out and implementing what works best we hit 'em with stuff - chainsaws, dams, rats, lead, harpoons, DDT, carbon dioxide - such that NOTHING works best.

That's how we end up with such a proliferation of species ... all adapted for specific purposes and constantly redesigning themselves.

CONSTANTLY, Bob. Go back twenty years and you'd never recognize that Kestrel as the same bird we see today - if we're very lucky.

I'm glad there are no standards dictating red tails or white tails in nature.

I'll bet you are, Bob. And I'll bet that if you found out standards WERE being dictated you'd whistle up your buddy Sam and you two would head out with your shotguns and address the issue.

One day I noticed a Crow out back with a slight bit of wing asymmetry. But he was moving and flying just fine. A short while later I saw him getting mobbed by what was undoubtedly his family group. They were killing him. He flees to somewhere else it's gonna be somebody else's territory and they're gonna kill him.

I know I'm not supposed to interfere but I couldn't stand it and broke things up - thereby delaying the inevitable outcome.

My best guess... That asymmetrical wing was gonna attract predators and the group has evolved to not tolerate that situation. So take your bullshit about nature not dictating standards and brutally enforcing them and shove it where it belongs.

[MikeLake]

Can you tell what's wrong with this:

17-11422
http://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8546/29432805605_c0c2c710bb_o.png


picture? Thousands of glider jockeys see thousands of pictures like that without batting an eye.

I'm sure this glider is a Discus (like mine). The spreader bar is fixed that low. I've no idea why!

[Tad Eareckson]

Gawd. I knew Aeros was fixing them low but I had no idea they were fixing them THAT low.

Here's my take...

Wills Wing - 1987/05/06

Sport

Check that the spreader bar is properly positioned just below the keel, (it will have been pulled down away from the keel during breakdown) and that it is aligned horizontally.

- The understanding of the function of the spreader is totally and permanently far beyond the reach of the collective wisdom of hang gliding culture - as is the function of the fuckin' owner's manual.

- The only place the spreader makes any real sense is where it's supposed to be - just under the keel/undersurface.

- If you position it an inch too low it contacts and mars the tops of the downtubes.

- Solution... Slide it lower.

- Still high enough to contact and mar the downtubes? See above.

- New glider with kingpost suspension? Ask an expert where to position the spreader and/or look at what everybody else is doing.

- Wanna manufacture a new hottish intermediate glider?
-- It's gotta have kingpost suspension 'cause everybody knows that's cool - despite the fact that nobody has the slightest fuckin' clue why.
-- You don't wanna do the extra buck and a half's worth of engineering to make the spreader slideable (like it needs to be for breakdown).
-- So you just rivet it to the strap nice and low where:
--- it won't gouge the downtubes
--- everybody's putting it and used to seeing it anyway

Real close analogy to the hang gliding weak link:
- nobody has a fuckin' clue what its purpose is supposed to be
- everybody knows you've gotta have one
- the lower it is the better it's gonna work.

1504
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[MikeLake]

The Discus example is not the best you could have picked out of the many others as I think the spreader is a bit wider than some.
However, it would still be a more effective if moved up a bit with no trade off I can see.

Twice I've seen WW gliders with the spreader bar as low down the strap as possible. In both instances I've pointer out the error and was told "this is how it was when I bought it." happy to continue flying with the 'default' setting. I've seen one spreader removed altogether!

[<BS>]

--

You don't wanna do the extra buck and a half's worth of engineering to make the spreader slideable (like it needs to be for breakdown).

If you're addressing manufacturers, being slideable is part of the problem. Rather than relying on the pilot understanding how the control system works, Bob Trampenau designed a clever solution, at least on the 510 C. The spreader bar is two separate pieces - same length, but different diameters so that one can go inside the other - and they are permanently attached just below the keel. For breakdown I pull them apart and tuck them in the keel pocket. I'm not sure of the cost difference, but the spreader is always in the correct position. Although you'll still need to put the pieces together.

[Tad Eareckson]

The Discus example is not the best you could have picked...

Links always appreciated. I get so much joy out of video/photo documentation of glider driver stupidity.

...out of the many others as I think the spreader is a bit wider than some.

Which means it needs to be positioned farther down.

However, it would still be a more effective if moved up a bit with no trade off I can see.

Needs to be right up damn near flush with the undersurface. All widening and lowering it does is add drag (and a tiny bit o' weight) for zero gain in functionality.

Twice I've seen WW gliders with the spreader bar as low down the strap as possible.

Like I said about hang glider weak links - just strong enough to get you above ten feet two out of three times.

...happy to continue flying with the 'default' setting.

Hopefully one or both of these blights on the gene pool will decide to run off the ramp with the carabiner at...

11-A12819
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...the 'default' setting.

I've seen one spreader removed altogether!

Makes more sense. Back in the bag it's doing about as much to reduce roll control effort with much less drag penalty.

This stupidity/insanity we see and hear from these individuals is just the tip of the iceberg. In order for those to happen there's gotta be a HUGE support network of fellow flyers, instructors, dealers, administrators.

And these are the assholes on whom Bob's relying to provide the collective wisdom necessary to drive the creativity, innovation, invention, evolution to move hang gliding steadily forward.

Bob Trampenau designed a clever solution...

That IS a clever solution. I actually did about the same thing on my glider but not 'cause I was clever or thinking about making things idiot proof. 'Twas 'cause the earlier Wills Wing spreaders had plastic end fittings, one of which would last on the average about four or five weekends before you forgot to clear the spreader before folding the control frame up and back, and that was the easiest replacement configuration I was able to do with hardware store resources.

I'm all for making things idiot proof, but when it's something that requires deliberate overwhelming stupidity to effect...

- spreader all the way down

- release pin flipped:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/psucvollibre/5935859745/


versus rotatated (see my avatar)

- very very reliable bent pin release:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/aerotowrelease/8331326948/


- standard aerotow weak link:

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8394/8696380718_787dbc0005_o.png


- two and a half inch pitch and lockout protector:



- releases within easy reach:




- pro toad bridles:

03-02421
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7200/14097626583_03972773c6_o.png


- carabiners used for two point aerotow release anchors being installed backwards

I'm totally cool with killing the guy.