landing

General discussion about the sport of hang gliding
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: landing

Post by Tad Eareckson »

Many years ago, I flew a suprone harness...
1. An inch of control movement - pitch, roll, or some combination of the two - high up on the downtubes is gonna have a lot more effect than an inch of control movement down on the basetube.

2. However... that inch up high will require proportionally more muscle to effect.

3. However... in normal nasty landing turbulence at reasonable landing speed muscle will be far from a limiting factor.

4. Because your arms are just so long, you get many more inches worth of positive pitch control range high on the downtubes and can stand the glider on its tail from a bit over stall speed and stop the glider on a dime.

5. However... because you can stuff the bar a lot farther back prone with your arms straight along your body than you can pull it back upright with your arms bent perpendicular to your body, your negative pitch control range goes to hell.

6. And, for the same reason that your arms, when you're upright with them bent perpendicular to your body, won't move very far back and because your hands can't tear loose from the downtubes when the glider stops and you swing through the control frame the way they're likely to when you're prone with your hands on the basetube...

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=22176
Paragliding Collapses
Jim Rooney - 2011/06/12 13:57:58 UTC

Most common HG injury... spiral fracture of the humerus.
...your probability of breaking an arm or two when the glider stops abruptly and you don't is pretty good. (And I know a lot of people who have - some of whom haven't recovered very well.)
The thing that bothers me about this approach is bleeding off speed in ground effect...
1. If you quickly go one up but low before you get to trim you can pretty easily go back down with the one hand if it becomes necessary to pour on some speed.

2. And then at trim or a little above you can bring the other hand up but low on the other downtube.

3. And then it's a lot harder to botch the rotation to vertical along with the slide of the hands to high on the downtubes.
...(not to mention leaving you vulnerable to turbulence just before you flare).
Let's not forget that you're vulnerable to turbulence and gusts WHILE you're flaring - an issue Dr. Rooney conveniently ignores in his landing thesis...

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26379
Landings

...on The Davis Show.
You do whatever works for you.
This forum isn't about people doing whatever works for them. It's about what works:

- best for anybody - assuming he has no more than the usual number of arms and has - on one or more occasion - spent over one or more minutes desperately searching for something he's holding in his left hand; and

- just super for just about everybody 99.99 percent of the time but fails so catastrophically the other 0.01 percent that it's really hard to justify not using what works best for all those other flights (especially if it's you on that one flight out of ten thousand).
Noman demonstrates good landing technique.
Yeah.
DO NOT do a long straight final.
...practice the low hard turns you need to get into a tight field.
NOW I understand that saying about the uselessness of runway behind you!
- Does a low hard turn twenty seconds from touchdown for a short final without a lot of wasted runway.
I'm of the opinion that one should have a real good reason for coming into a field in which the drag afforded by being upright versus prone is likely to be a critical factor in preventing one from overshooting the end or crest.
- Leaves himself enough room so he doesn't need to generate drag by going upright to keep from overshooting.
Especially if you hold that pitch down input all the way into ground effect.
- Holds the bar in all the way down to skim altitude which he reaches eight seconds from touchdown.
Go upright AFTER the gradient. That way you'll never be wishing you had more of the glider's speed range available to you to punch through the gradient and whatever other invisible crap may be lurking below.
One up / one down is NOT upright. One up / one down can be prone, upright, or something in between but is usually the latter.
- Goes one up / one down and starts rocking up a second later.
But maybe much less NEED to hug a downtube when carrying the extra speed allowed by staying prone down into ground effect?
If you make the strong pitch down input BEFORE a wing is forced up or down the wing is a helluva lot less likely to get forced up or down.
- Carries enough speed so that he doesn't need to hug a downtube to fight a roll.
Go upright AFTER the gradient.
- Continues to rock up as he slows to trim.
1. IF you really wanna do "THE" transition do it AT trim 'cause the glider's a lot less likely to do anything amusing when you take a hand off the basetube.

2. And if you fuck up the transition it's not likely to be that B an F'ing D.
- Shifts his second hand up to the downtube at about trim four seconds from touchdown when the glider doesn't notice and where if he fucks up the transition it's not likely to be that B an F'ing D.

- Then does a gentle flare and stops on a dime.

Yeah, good landing technique all around I'd say.
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Re: landing

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http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26379
Landings
Jim Rooney - 2012/01/20 09:52:10 UTC

I teach the moonwalk first as this one introduces something new... the ability to screw up.
With the moonwalk, you might wind up belly flopping and rolling on your wheels... BFD.
Yeah Jim. And how much of a BFD would it be if you just DELIBERATELY screwed up so as to eliminate any possibility of the belly flopping part before you rolled to a stop? More or less?
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Re: landing

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http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26379
Landings
Jim Rooney - 2012/01/21 04:49:59 UTC

Wheels.

I nearly forgot a very important one.
This goes ahead of everything else, but is very often overlooked for many reasons.
Landing on the wheels... on purpose.

The significance of this didn't dawn on me till I started spending a lot of time doing tandems and very little time flying solo. It's not till you start doing "production tandems" that this idea enters your world. I was working as a commercial tandem pilot at a place where we land the tandems on wheels and being a foreigner, I didn't have a solo glider readily available. Every now and then, I'd hop on a tandem and fly it solo, but most of the time I just flew my paraglider. Well, this makes for a very interesting situation. You're exceptionally current at flying, but horribly uncurrent at foot landing. Not a mix you find often. So when you do wind up finally getting back on a solo glider, there is quite the nagging thought in the back of your head... "how rusty have I become?".

And here's the strange strange answer... not much at all.
The reason why is the interesting bit.

All those wheel landings actually help... a lot.
See, with the wheel landings, we're doing all the landing bits except final flare. AND... we're actually doing a bit of that as well.

You're diving at the earth (faster than trim) and flying the glider way down into ground effect... then you're maintaining height, often for as long as possible because passengers (and you) love it. It's fun as hell. Up hill, down hill, into wind, with the wind, cross wind... who cares? You're on wheels. Over and over and over.

You get very very very in tune with your glider.
Because you're landing on your belly (and the passenger's belly) all blessed day long, you instinctively become gentle about it as well.
So, you skim the earth for a very long time, then you give a bit of a shove at the end and more plop down rather than just skidding in. Sometimes you do skid in and sometimes you smash it onto the wheels a little early, but it's the plop ones that are important in regards to foot landings. Cuz, yup... they correlate directly to the flare. You're just pushing out on the base bar instead of slaming the uprights up.

It's not exactly the same of course. As they say, there's nothing like the real thing.
But damn if it doesn't help more than you'd expect.
I know it shocked me.

You're also managing all the "other" parts of landing without a cluttered mind that's worrying about sorting the flare.
So then when you switch back to doing the flare bit, you're not bothered about the other bits because they're automatic by this point.

We do this all the time with students that we teach via aerotowing.
They get loads of practice at all the other bits of landing before they get anywhere near flaring.
Only after they've got everything else down, do we progress them.
And it makes for a very easy transition.
I nearly forgot a very important one.
Yeah, we've done the Moonwalk, Trim Plus One, Two Step, Crescendo, and Zen. And we almost forgot the one that all the tandem pilots use when they make a zillion flights a day and don't wanna break their gliders or arms or mangle their passengers.
This goes ahead of everything else, but is very often overlooked for many reasons.
Yeah. Unnaturally high testosterone levels combined with astronomical stupidity - including the belief that if you don't perform every landing as if you were coming down in a narrow dry riverbed with large rocks strewn all over the place or a field filled with seven foot high corn you will inevitably die in a narrow dry riverbed with large rocks strewn all over the place or a field filled with seven foot high corn.
Landing on the wheels... on purpose.
MY GOD!!! Surely thou dost jest!!!
The significance of this didn't dawn on me...
It's beyond comprehension how many blindingly obvious things of significance haven't dawned on you - and never will.
It's not till you start doing "production tandems" that this idea enters your world.
I've only done seven tandems in by life - none instructional, just little hill hops with friends - and I didn't need any of them to assess situations in which attempting foot landings would be moronic.

As a matter of fact my very first flight on a hang glider - a Kitty Hawk trainer on 1980/04/02 - was an easy natural wheel landing. And when I worked there as an instructor a lot of my better students ignored my instructions for standup landings and rolled just fine as well.
You're exceptionally current at flying, but horribly uncurrent at foot landing.
Damn near all recreational pilots are horribly non current at foot landings. That's 'cause they're more interested in getting thermal time than they are practicing stupid, dangerous, mostly useless foot landings.
Not a mix you find often.
Yeah? Did you ever watch the LZ at Ridgely? Or Lookout? Or any other high traffic areas with typical hang glider pilots coming in?
You're diving at the earth (faster than trim) and flying the glider way down into ground effect...
You mean like pretty much ANY aircraft comes in on final?
It's fun as hell. Up hill, down hill, into wind, with the wind, cross wind... who cares? You're on wheels. Over and over and over.
1. So you come in on wheels over and over and over, terrain and wind direction are never an issue, you don't have any problems, and it's FUN. Wow!!!
Don Boardman
Rome, New York

1982/12

The landings, by the way, are the greatest. You come in just like a seaplane and touch down gently skimming on the water's surface.

1983/05

The floats allow a prone in the water start and a seaplane like landing ... level off hot about a foot above the water ... hold ... smooth, fun, prone landings.
Who'da thunk!!!

2. So I guess you're not doing a whole lot of landings in narrow dry riverbeds with large rocks strewn all over the place or fields filled with seven foot high corn, huh?
Christian Thoreson - 2004/10

Thus wheel landings, the safest and easiest way to consistently land a hang glider...
3. So can I put you down as being in total agreement with Christian on this issue?
Because you're landing on your belly (and the passenger's belly) all blessed day long, you instinctively become gentle about it as well.
But the landings are "GENTLE"... I dunno. This just doesn't sound like real hang gliding to me.
Jim Rooney - 2012/01/19 19:00:29

Landing a HG is unnatural.
To do it well, you must come in fast.
You must stop the glider and make it tailslide... something you never do otherwise and never even toy with otherwise as the results would be disasterous.
Now THAT sounds like REAL hang gliding!!! Unnatural, stopping the glider and making it tailslide, something you would never do otherwise nor even toy with as the results would be disastrous! Sure is a good thing there's no possibility whatsoever of any of that stupid bullshit being disastrous at one of the two most dangerous phases of flight, right Kevin Carter? Paul? Lauren? Sparky?
So, you skim the earth for a very long time, then you give a bit of a shove at the end and more plop down rather than just skidding in.
What if you get into turbulence? It's a glider carrying two people and big enough to do the job but you've only got one person providing the muscle? Don't you REALLY need to go upright and hug a downtube for adequate roll control. Eh...
The Press - 2006/03/15

However, he took off without attaching himself.
In a video, he was seen to hold on to the glider for about fifty meters before hitting power lines.
Rooney and the passenger fell about fifteen meters to the ground.
I guess you guys are just too concerned about the safety of your passengers to fly them in turbulence.
You're just pushing out on the base bar instead of slaming the uprights up.
Does that really work? I'da thunk it would be just the opposite. You have so much less positive pitch authority on the basetube. I'da thunk you'd just push out high on the uprights and really hafta slame the basetube up. This is so very confusing.
It's not exactly the same of course. As they say, there's nothing like the real thing.
Yeah, it's not the REAL thing. None of this brain dead safe and easy, worry free, low stress, fun crap. Let's start getting REAL, dude.
You're also managing all the "other" parts of landing without a cluttered mind that's worrying about sorting the flare.
Oh. So even YOUR mind - which one would think lacks the capacity to accumulate much of anything - tends to be cluttered worrying about sorting out the flare.
The Ledger - 2009/11/17
Jeremy Maready

Vermont Man Dies in Davenport Hang Glider Crash - Volunteer firefighter was gliding near Davenport Sunday (2009/11/15) when he hit tree, police say.

Anthony Ameo, 59, of Sheffield, Vermont was trying to land when he struck a pine tree and fell nearly 25 feet, according to the Polk County Sheriff's Office and officials at Wallaby Ranch, a facility that caters to hang gliders.

Ameo was flown to Lakeland Regional Medical Center where he died during surgery.

A friend said Ameo began hang gliding about three years ago and was practicing for his intermediate rating. He had passed a written test and was practicing for his flying test, which would measure his ability to set up a proper approach and flare the glider at the appropriate time to land on his feet.

"The transition (from flaring the glider to landing) takes a lot of eye-to-hand coordination," said Eugene Pettinato, Ameo's friend and flying partner. "That was his weakest area, I think."
So do you think it might actually SAFER for your average recreational pilot to forget about sorting out the goddam fucking flare and just worry about landing the fucking glider instead? Just kidding.
Gil Dodgen - 1995/01

All of this reminds me of a comment Mike Meier made when he was learning to fly sailplanes. He mentioned how easy it was to land a sailplane (with spoilers for glide-path control and wheels), and then said, "If other aircraft were as difficult to land as hang gliders no one would fly them."
And do you think there's any chance that we might have more people having more fun more safely just doing wheel landings? When you're doing the math think about the people who won't fly hang gliders 'cause they're too difficult to foot land, have been injured, crippled, and killed because they attempted foot landings, and the people who find other hobbies because they've heard about or seen other people injured, crippled, and killed because they attempted foot landings.
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: landing

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http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26379
Landings
Rob Clarkson - 2012/01/22 09:56:35 UTC

I don't disagree that we don't do enough training on how to land and in general hang glider pilots don't land very well.
Yeah. That's probably because, in general, hang glider pilots are inherently inferior to Cessna pilots. That's my best guess anyway.
Keeping pilots safe is my main priority.
Mine too. Do them, me, and yourself a big favor and stay the hell out of towing discussions.
I don't care if they can land or ever get off the ground as long as they don't get hurt.
No no no no. It doesn't matter if, how often, or how badly they get hurt practicing to land in narrow dry riverbeds with large rocks strewn all over the place or fields filled with seven foot high corn. Because the price of not perfecting their emergency landing technique is almost certain death WHEN they land in narrow dry riverbeds with large rocks strewn all over the place or fields filled with seven foot high corn.
We are talking about the first day here and learning the basics from scratch. Yes you have them run on flat ground and get a feel for the glider. If this is the point you are getting them to flair and making that the first priority before you ever move them up the hill, you are going to get people hurt and break the glider.
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=22176
Paragliding Collapses
Jim Rooney - 2011/06/12 13:57:58 UTC

Most common HG injury... spiral fracture of the humerus.
ANY TIME you stress whipstalling as a routine landing procedure you're going to get people hurt and gliders broken.
I want to see students have good speed and keep the glider going straight and level (learning to fly it). I don't even want to see them push out never mind a full on flair.
Stay with that.
If the wings are not level and they full on flair with any speed bad shit is going to happen.
Too bad Lauren didn't grasp that concept before or - undoubtedly - AFTER she ripped her shoulder apart.
I'd rather see them fall down and slide on their belly. No harm done.
REALLY?! I don't think I've ever heard this sentiment expressed before. What if they're landing in a narrow dry riverbed with large rocks strewn all over the place or a field filled with seven foot high corn?
Until I am sure they can keep the glider straight every flight and be aware of when it isn't and able to correct it I don't want to see a full on flare.
So you're more concerned that they learn to FLY the glider than you are about standup landings? Dude, I don't know about this approach.

http://OzReport.com/14.129
Packsaddle accident report
Shane Nestle - 2010/06/30 13:01:28 UTC

The problem began when he initiated his turn. Being that John was still very new to flying in the prone position, I believe that he was likely not shifting his weight, but simply turning his body in the direction he wanted to turn.
Have you run it by Jeff Hunt and gotten his opinion?
I've never seen any one gain this skill the first day.
I'm not real sure I've really seen anybody really nail this skill the first few decades.

Before and After
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zzMbdtOhAk
Sparkozoid - 2011/11/27
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14-00725
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I know for sure I didn't.
Once they have the skill to get the glider to fly straight then take them back to the flat ground and work full on flares.
1. Do you ever check back with them and compare the number of broken downtubes and arms to the number of times they've actually needed full flares?

2. Your spelling of "flare" is getting better.

3. Wanna say anything about deliberate wheel landings as default options?
You can't learn to land before you learn to fly. Trying to teach it that way is going to get people hurt and gliders broken.
Nah. That's only true in REAL aviation.
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Re: landing

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http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26379
Landings
Christopher LeFay - 2012/01/23 08:42:22 UTC

Jim's enthusiasm for scooter towing is infections...
The same can be said about pretty much any aspect of his participation in the sport and, for that matter, life in general. Always has been, always will be.
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Re: landing

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http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26379
Landings
Christian Williams - 2012/01/23 17:21:59 UTC

From what I've seen, current students land pretty well. If somebody with ten hours whacks bad, the whole house comes down on his head - what a moron, what a spastic geekoid embarrassment to mankind, etc., everybody gives him advice and then the local instructors pout and wave theirs arms and take him aside for reprogramming and stern socratic lectures (Where were your hands? When did you unzip? What were the streamers telling you?).

This is at any popular teaching site with lots of traffic and instructors with reputations (You're training that guy? He's a menace!).

But when a veteran pounds in it's "that Predator is hard to land", "yeah, there's always sink there", and "he hasn't been flying much".

It's been said here many times that for experienced pilots, landings are .05 percent of the flying experience. For mountain foot-launch especially, they're really really inconvenient to practice. I never got much out of sand dune practice where there really are no flight pattern decisions to make and it's laminar and you flare like a genius every time.

It would appear that pilots like Davis cites just aren't able to get enough practice, and are relatively insulated from criticism (even when they ask for it).

The answer must be to somehow obtain more practice.

Scooter tow. I never had the chance to do it once.
1. How many of these experienced and mountain foot launch pilots are doing most of their landings in fields which necessitate standups?

2. I'm guessing most experienced pilots in other flavors of aviation only get a rather small percentage of their time doing the touchdown part of the landing - which is the part with which we're having the trouble. And yet they don't seem to have comparable difficulties. To what do you attribute the difference?

3. Take a Cessna pilot with Hang Three equivalency and ground him for ten years. Who's more likely to plant the nose on his next landing: him or a Hang Four who flies every weekend?
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Re: landing

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AndreasWolk

Maybe you came in with the wind? (See the windsock at 03'04''.)
sharkflyer2

Yea I probably did that too, I know I got my hands behind the wires and pushed forward instead of up to flare.
A world record for number of wires hooked? A tie for first in any case.
mitchelman

Ouch! Man you're fast... What kind of glider is that?
sharkflyer2

It's an Airborne Sting - a beginner glider. I wasn't very experienced at that time. It shows what not to do.
It shows whoever it was who signed your Two should be shot. I thought I was watching a deliberate speed run.

And what procedure(s) are you using such that you can pick up your glider, walk to launch position, skip the hook-in check, and run off the cliff in full confidence that your carabiner isn't dangling behind your knees? Just kidding.
dkjens0705

When I got to the higher performance gliders (Sensor B Full Race, HPII, HPAT 158, RamAir) I would always come in at least with base tube between chest and naval for speed, the bleed it of a couple of feet over the ground, letting the glider more or less fly itself, and transition to an upright position with hands high on the downtubes.
Didn't you ever need to go upright earlier for the superior roll authority that configuration affords?
You can never go wrong with an aggressive flare.
Talk to Kevin Carter about that. It seems to me that a lot fewer people go wrong just skimming prone along the runway and letting the glider settle onto the wheels of its own accord.

Guess it was a good thing he didn't let those Finsterwalder wheels do the job in this case. No telling what might have happened in a field like that.
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Re: landing

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http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26379
Landings
John Simon - 2012/01/25 17:46:52 UTC
Annapolis

Zach and Adam
So there it is...
It's Sunny's fault I can't land...
Hey Jim!
1. Yeah John, when you can get through a career as a carrier pilot without a scratch and on a hang glider you break two arms coming into a wide open empty airport in nothing conditions solely because you're so freaking hardwired about spots and standup landings that you can't figure out how not to fly into a taxiway sign I'd say you DO need to think a little bit about the quality of the instruction (in addition to considering if you're just a wee bit wanting in the common sense department).

2. I watched Sunny come in on a topless right next to me, punch a flare about five seconds too early, damn near go into orbit, and come down in an undignified manner. I commented, "Thank you. Now I don't feel so bad about this (the grass stain on my knee) any more."

I don't give a rat's ass who the hell you are or how much experience you have - you routinely opt for a demanding, inherently dangerous, stunt landing enough times you're gonna eventually end up in a heap and maybe bend or break something.

3. It's my fault you have a straight pin release. It's the fault of Sunny, Adam, Zach, and Jim that you're using it in conjunction with an overlength one point bridle and a loop of 130 pound Greenspot.

4. Fuck Adam, Zach, and Jim.
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Re: landing

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http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26379
Landings
Jerry Furnell (Suneagle) - 2012/01/26 00:54:09 UTC
Canungra

Great information Jim.
A question from my experience.

Q: Perfect approach into light wind on a strong thermic day; I'm slowing to trim in ground effect in a topless glider, almost at trim speed with my hands moved to the uprights and me fully out of prone when something unexpected causes one wing tip to rise. Suddenly I'm no longer straight and level. My (Oh no!) flare resulted in a nasty whack, bloody nose, banged up shoulder, and a broken upright. This during a comp and landing at goal for maximum embarrassment and pain :). Hope I've painted the picture well enough for your advice, as trying to land/flare when wings are not level at the critical moment has probably happened to most pilots at some time or other.

There are several reasons for a wing tip rising, some pilot error, others not. Or would you say that they are all pilot error?

Obviously I'd like to know how to avoid the occasional rising wingtip, but I'd also like to know what is the best way to handle it once you've encumbered yourself with one?

Or do you just have to pay the ferryman?
Lessee...
- Slowed almost down to trim.
- Fully upright with both hands on the downtubes for roll authority beyond anyone's wildest dreams.
- But you get rolled anyway.
- And then you FLARE - 'cause, dude, this is hang gliding and NOT flaring simply isn't done.
- And you get beat up and snap a downtube.

I dunno... Sounds like you did everything as well as could be expected. Sometimes shit just happens in hang gliding and there's really nothing that can be done.

That's all I got. Have you talked to Lauren and Sparky yet? They might have some insights on the issues that are far beyond my level of expertise.
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Re: landing

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http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26379
Landings
Jim Rooney - 2012/01/26 02:08:15 UTC

Awesome question Jerry!
I totally agree.
I'll answer what I know...
Since when did not having the slightest fucking clue start stopping you from stating your idiot opinions as indisputable facts?
...but bear in mind that I'm just an other idiot out there...
You're WAY too modest.
I don't have "the" answers, I just have "my" answers ;)
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24846
Is this a joke ?
Jim Rooney - 2011/08/31 09:25:57 UTC

You've not heard about strong-link incidents.
Uh, yeah... cuz we don't let you use them.
And anybody who knows that you and "your" answers are full o' shit can go fuck himself.
Yup, this ain't a perfect world and sh*t happens... and we've got to deal with it.
So, what do you do when _____?
As long as you don't land on the wheels it simply doesn't matter.
I'll start with the big one... it's the cardinal rule of landing (and taking off for that matter)... WINGS LEVEL.
Wings level is above all else.
Keeping your nose down on takeoff is at the end of the day, all about keeping your wings level. If you don't, you drop a wingtip.
1. What about on landing? Wouldn't keeping your nose down on landing be the overwhelming factor on the issue of keeping your wings level?
2. In which configuration - prone or upright - can you more easily and farther get your nose nose down?
(You paying any attention to this, miguel?)
So... what to do when they're not?
Get them level, at nearly any cost. Do nothing else until they are.
We're not trying to save a graceful landing at this point... we're trying not to get hurt.
If you touch the ground with your wings level, it will almost certainly be better, and heaps better, than if they are not.
If they're not, when you touch, you're going for a cartwheel ride. It's going to suck.

If they're level, you might just pancake in. You might break some uprights. Who cares? Break them. Grab one and plow through it. Don't grab both as you'll break your arms. All the usual "crashing" advice. Hopefully it doesn't even get that far.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zzMbdtOhAk
Before and After
Sparkozoid - 2011/11/27
dead
14-00725
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Any chance of getting seriously fucked up if the wings ARE level?
I've landed my talon downwind on my belly with no wheels and everything just skidded in... the nose never even came down. Level level level.
1. What? A highly skilled consummate professional such as yourself, experience beyond comprehension, the greatest hang gliding instructor the world has ever known? And with the Moonwalk, Trim Plus One, Two Step, Crescendo, and Zen at your disposal? And you STILL bellied in?

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24846
Is this a joke ?
Jim Rooney - 2011/08/25 04:55:25

Some weekend warrior isn't about to inform me about jack sh*t...
2. Just like some miserable weekend warrior pudknocker?

Dude, who'da thunk?
A good shove on the basetube right at the end helped. You can't flare prone, but you sure as hell can try... and it does matter.
And you couldn't even get your hands up on the downtubes? I'm not seeing much hope for us miserable weekend warrior pudknockers.
So how were you able to maintain roll control from way down there?
(thankfully faired basetubes slide well on semi-wet grass, especially if you get them going slow enough)
1. So you're saying it tends not to be that B AN F'ing D if you just belly in? Even downwind without wheels?
2. What if you're landing in a narrow dry riverbed with large rocks strewn all over the place or a field filled with seven foot high corn?
#1 Goal, get the wings level.
If you can't in time, DO NOT flare!
Flaring in a turn will always go bad... and it'll go bad fast.
Don't even semi-flare.
Don't even continue to slow down.
Your goal is still to get your wings level... if that means speeding up... guess what? You do it. Get those wings level... then, once they are, you can huck that puppy over your head and save yourself from pounding in... but only once you get them level.

Now, this is where those other landing techniques come in very handy.
This is why I teach my students to stop themselves with the glider before I even let them leave the ground.
I shudder at the thought of any of your students ever leaving the ground. Ditto with respect to your passengers.
That "moonwalk" landing can save your butt.
You're all setup for a perfect landing when ole mama nature decides to bitchslap you.
Ok... panicroom time.
We've just shifted gears from a nice "showstopper" landing to "not pounding in".

We've maybe even had to nudge the bars in a touch to get them level again. We're still in a non-advantageous position.
We're faster than we can run and things are happening too fast to pull out a good flare. Hell, we probably don't have the wings level yet and it's "touch the earth" time.

So moonwalk-run. Finish leveling the wings as you do it, then you're just doing a moonwalk landing from that point on.
If you know the moonwalk, this is extremely easy.
So there's just no possible way ol' Mama Nature can neutralize your Moonwalk efforts. That's really reassuring to know.
So I guess there's really no advantage to even having a pair of wheels as an option.
I highly recommend learning it if you don't already know it.
Start on an easy glider first btw... learn the technique... then apply it to your glider.
I learned the moonwalk on a Falcon. Then a Sport 2... then I moved on to my gliders.

I'm a stingy bastard.
I'da gone with arrogant, thankless, disrespectful little shit.
I only pay the piper when I absolutely have to.
And in New Zealand after you do something stupid and grossly negligent and the public health system puts you back together - you don't have to.
I've paid the man, don't get me wrong...
Bullshit.
...but I avoid it as long as I can.
But maybe with a bit of luck someday...
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