Blue Sky Scooter Towing
Ground Markers
As already discussed, at least one clearly visible ground marker - such as an orange cone - should be placed at a point two thirds of the way from the scooter to the return pulley. This marks the limit of how far the beginning student should fly under tow. Under no circumstances do you want to have any risk of the student overflying the return pulley and being pulled towards the ground by the tow rope...
Well yeah, obviously. But even if he does, isn't it a fairly simple matter for the him to dump the line? I mean...
The activation handle for the top release is attached on the downtube, near the location where the student will be holding the downtube in flight.
...the activation handle for the top release is attached on the downtube, near the location where the student will be holding the downtube in flight. I'm not really seeing how this should be too much of a problem.
...(which, at this stage of the training, passes OVER the basetube).
At what stage of the training does it pass UNDER the basetube?
On the initial flights, when there is no plan for the student to release from the tow rope, the instructor will ease the student back down to the ground before he reaches the marker by gently reducing tension on the tow line.
Doesn't sound like you assholes...
Gregg B. McNamee - 1996/12
Primary Release Criteria
To actuate the primary release the pilot does not have to give up any control of the glider. (Common sense tells us that the last thing we want to do in an emergency situation is give up control of the glider in order to terminate the tow.)
If your system requires you to take your hand off the control bar to actuate the release it is not suitable.
...EVER have much of a plan for the student to release from the tow rope.
On later flights where the student has been instructed to release, if he fails to do so the instructor will again gently reduce power to ease the student back to the ground before reaching the marker.
Why don't you just chop power?
http://www.chgpa.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2467
weak links
Jim Rooney - 2007/08/01 13:47:23 UTC
Whatever's going on back there, I can fix it by giving you the rope.
Everybody knows that there's no problem on tow that can't be fixed by the driver chopping power.
In either situation, the instructor should never cut the power suddenly, but rather gradually reduce power to reduce the tension on the rope and make the glider descend, without stopping the rope entirely. Enough power should be maintained on the scooter to continue to take up the rope onto the winch reel as the glider flies forward, until the landing occurs.
Sorry dude.
Jim Rooney - 2007/08/01 19:49:30 UTC
It's more of this crappy argument that being on tow is somehow safer than being off tow.
This just sounds like more of this crappy argument that being on tow is somehow safer than being off tow. I'm not buying it.
Students at more advanced levels will, of necessity, be achieving altitudes that would allow them to overfly the return pulley. For this reason, a reliable means of cutting the rope at the scooter must be available to the instructor...
Why?
- When a free flying student has been cleared to solo from two hundred feet is there somebody available to do his job for him if he can't?
- How many times have you had to cut the towline in the seventeen thousand scooter tows you've pulled?
- And why aren't you telling telling us the circumstances and failures which precipitated these incidents?
...and, once again, it is fundamentally necessary that it not be possible for the rope to be snagged or fouled by the pulley or the pulley anchor.
But it's OK to use a spinnaker shackle for a release mechanism which is very obviously capable of snagging a weak link...
http://www.flickr.com/photos/aerotowrelease/8318769461/
...and killed someone someone twenty-six months ago in doing so.
Also, no student who has not clearly demonstrated the ability to release properly and reliably, using both the standard and the back up releases, should be allowed to attain an altitude or position from which he could overfly the return pulley.
Right.
If your system requires you to take your hand off the control bar to actuate the release it is not suitable.
- You equip the student with total crap and tell him that it "works well for scooter towing".
- If he manages to pry it open a couple of times when the glider's trim, he's got plenty of time, and everything's going great then you check him off as having clearly demonstrated the ability to release properly and reliably and allow him into situations in which his life may be dependent upon his ability to release properly and reliably.
- I got news for ya, motherfucker. If you read a few fatality reports it doesn't take very long to reach the conclusion that NO ONE has the ability to blow these things properly and reliably.
- And you know goddam well that the equipment itself isn't proper or reliable or you wouldn't be sending people up with piece of shit "backup" release to back up a piece of shit primary release - without ever once giving us the slightest excuse of an explanation about the circumstances which would require a "backup" release.
- Typically when the shit hits the fan low people do not survive Wallaby releases.
- The idea that - at scooter tow altitude - a piece of shit bent pin barrel "backup" release mounted on a hip is gonna be of any use whatsoever after one of the fairly routine failures of the piece of shit Wallaby release is patently absurd.
- How many tows have you had in which someone has successfully actuated a "backup" release after a Wallaby release didn't "work well for scooter towing"?
http://www.ozreport.com/9.133
Lesson from an aerotow accident report
USHGA Accident Report Summary
Pilot: Holly Korzilius
Reporter: Steve Wendt, USHGA Instructor # 19528
Date : 5/29/05
Holly immediately had control problems right off the dolly and completed 3 oscilations before it took her 90 degrees from the tow vehicle upon when the tug pilot hit the release and Holly continued turning away from the tow in a fairly violent exchange of force . Holly pulled in to have control speed and then began rounding out , but there was not enough altitude and she hit the ground before she could do so. She was barely 100 feet when she was locked out in a left hand turn. At that time, she was banked up over 60 degrees.
The basebar hit the ground first, nose wires failed from the impact, and at the same time she was hitting face first.
- At what stage of Holly's training had she clearly demonstrated the ability to release properly and reliably, using both the standard and the back up releases?
This release shall be operational with zero tow line force up to twice the rated breaking strength of the weak link.
- Does the barrel type release she had at her right side attachment point comply with aerotowing regulations?
- Where was her backup weak link?
- Why are you referring to this as a BACKUP release here and a SECONDARY release at every other reference?
Additionally, when students are making higher flights, it is of paramount importance for the instructor to be aware, at all times, of the relationship of the tow line to the basetube - the angle of inclination of the student's location above that of the turn around pulley must never be allowed to approach the point where the tow rope would contact and impinge on the basetube, as this could cause the rope to impart a nose down pitching moment to the glider and create a very dangerous situation.
You mean like killing someone instantly? À la Shane Smith - 2011/01/15?
If your system requires you to take your hand off the control bar to actuate the release it is not suitable.
Good thing you're equipping your students with the finest towing equipment we mere mortals are capable of developing - an aerotow type V-bridle and release system which works well for scooter towing. Motherfucker.
Other ground markers can be set out as targets or points of focus for the student for use in various tasks, but it is important that the two thirds limit marker be clearly distinguishable to both the students and the instructor and that everyone clearly understand the significance of it.
Yeah, we understand.
That's the point at which the guy on the throttle starts losing his ability to protect us and we start becoming totally dependent on an aerotow type V-bridle and release system works well for scooter towing.
That's the point at which scooter towing starts looking a bit like the real world aerotowing to which we're soon to graduate.
And we've all seen what can happen with an aerotow type V-bridle and release system which works well for scooter towing when it's used for aerotowing.
Don't worry. No fuckin' way I'm getting anywhere NEAR that cone while I'm still connected to the towline with an aerotow type V-bridle and release system which works well for scooter towing. I'm probably gonna try to sneak it back a few yards when nobody's looking.