instructors and other qualified pilot fiends

[Tad Eareckson]

I know I've already done an extensive hatchet job starting here:
http://www.kitestrings.org/post1482.html#p1482
on this:

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=25302
Interview with Davis Straub, OzReport founder

Jack Show "discussion" but it's so outrageous - so ORWELLIAN - that I couldn't resist organizing and posting the key comments from that tangle of hypocrisy and lunacy...

Kostya Marchenko - 2012/02/20 21:11:34 UTC

We recently published an interview with Davis Straub where he talks about his early days, how he started hang gliding, about Oz Report and other things.

Read it here:
http://aviacamp.com/

Allen Sparks - 2012/02/20 21:44:47 UTC

fascinating ...
to round it out, you should also do an interview with hang gliding safety activist Tad Eareckson
http://www.kitestrings.org/topic2.html

NMERider - 2012/02/20 23:27:48 UTC

Paul Hurless - 2012/02/21 01:58:42 UTC

Good idea, if by activist you mean "arrogant asshole".

Dan Johnson (theayeinthesky) - 2012/02/21 03:49:37 UTC

I would join OZ, except the rules seem narcissistic on his part.
Jack is a paragon of free speech.

Paul Hurless - 2012/02/21 03:50:21 UTC

I don't believe it's necessary for me to supplement my reference to Tad as an arrogant asshole with any arguments seeing as how he pretty much made them all on his own and now he's no longer here on the .org.

What else would you call someone who offered numerous abusive attacks on anyone who dared to disagree with his views?

Newton - 2012/02/21 04:32:30 UTC

Responsible

Dan Johnson - 2012/02/21 05:10:07 UTC

For making this statement:

I'm also not in favor of everybody who gets into this sport getting back out alive.

WTF?

Newton - 2012/02/21 06:08:45 UTC

Try READING more and asking less.

Dan Johnson - 2012/02/21 07:04:31 UTC

OK, Newton! Who the fuck are you to presume to tell me what to do?
Go back to the basement where you belong.

Your on my pending ignore list, if you have nothing to say but sociopathic fixations with failure to hook in instances, you need to see a specialist in these sort of mental disorders right away!

Tormod Helgesen - 2012/02/21 16:16:24 UTC

Once I commented on something errenious Davis wrote, He subsequently edited his post without commenting on his changes, made me look like an ass. Stayed (mostly) away from threads where he's active since.

Jim Gaar - 2012/02/21 21:20:27 UTC

No Tad - No Newton

Miller Stroud - 2012/02/21 22:46:25 UTC

Hey I commented on a Rigid issue at a comp once and Davis jumped right in there and in so many words said I didn't have a clue and I was probably an Ass. (I was still right) Ok, no feelings hurt. The Man does do alot to expose the sport of hang gliding to the world and I enjoy most of what he puts out. And the bottom line. The Oz Report is his. He created it. He owns it. He can say what he pleases. If you don't like it, tune out!

Mike Bomstad - 2012/02/24 05:28:53 UTC

http://www.kitestrings.org/topic2.html

So this is where is went to start his shit!
Wow, what a shit talker.

Newton - 2012/02/24 05:43:57 UTC

Is that a sentence?

Mike Bomstad - 2012/02/24 05:58:12 UTC

It is now.
You can go post it on your other group now Tad.

Jack Axaopoulos - 2012/02/24 14:38:01 UTC

How interesting....
Newtons IP address and AeroTows IP addresses both come from the Wichita Kansas area.
Care to explain newton? Total coincidence?

Brad Barkley - 2012/02/24 14:51:15 UTC

I think this thread answers your question......
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=24633
FTHI

Jack Axaopoulos - 2012/02/24 15:00:21 UTC

Tad has been BANNED again.

The "Extremist 1%" is not allowed on this site. Go crawl back under your rock with Bob and the other extremists that get themselves banned from every site and group they deal with. You guys have a marvelous record of getting along with people.

You can tell yourselves how you are all right, the other 99% are all wrong, and how everyone who disagrees with you is a nazi censor to make yourselves feel better. (Just ignore the hypocrisy that Bob runs the most tightfisted, censored HG forum out there ) Its ok, the rules dont apply to you guys, you are all "special"
-
Thomas Jefferson wrote:

All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent.

Jack Axaopoulos - 2012/02/24

No posts or links about Bob K, Scott C Wise, Tad Eareckson and related people, or their material. ALL SUCH POSTS WILL BE IMMEDIATELY DELETED. These people are poison to this sport and are permanently banned from this site in every possible way imaginable.

Dan Johnson - 2012/02/24 16:15:13 UTC

Talk about being a mensch? Thanks, SG! And thank PaulH for clueing me in!

Paul Hurless - 2012/02/25 02:52:05 UTC

You're welcome.

Mike Bomstad - 2012/02/25 05:45:28 UTC

Ditto.

Dan Johnson - 2012/02/25 09:41:03 UTC

Really Spark gets the hat tip on this thread, but I read the name first from the man in Reno.
Now, let's get back to giving Davis his due, and suggesting more interviews!

Yeah, paragon of the free speech the US military is spraying Hellfire missiles around and driving over and stepping on land mines supposedly to protect - just as long as it meets with the approval of the mediocre majority.

A couple/three decades ago you could find comments like these:

David Wilson - 1980/03
Tahlequah, Oklahoma

I would like to respond to what I view as a relatively irresponsible and shortsighted argument put forth in January's issue by a Dr. L.D. Hewett.

Chris Gagliano - 1990/11
San Antonio

I understand that this magazine can't police (nor should it) every harebrained statement by all the self-appointed "hang gliding gurus" on towing or foot launch, so here's my advice for the latest guru. I am referring to Brad Lindsay's article on towing safety in the September issue.

in the magazine. Now USHGA's just one big happy terminally stupid family in which Dr. Trisa Tilletti can publish any load of crap (s)he feels like with no fear whatsoever of being called to account.

Davis has edited, sabotaged, locked, deleted and banned his way to conformity and, in the wake of the 2012/04/28 Lenami Godinez-Avila fatality / global scandal, locked his forum down to the public and anyone he's been able to identify as a threat to his him and his cartel.

http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1041
"Sharing" of Hang Gliding Information ?!?

Merlin - 2012/05/26 13:22:30 UTC

I confess to previously having a bit of an Oz Report habit, but the forced login thing has turned me off permanently, and I am in fact grateful. Frankly, the site had pretty much been reduced to a few dedicated sycophants in any case.

I've seen many times the destructive consequences of "control freaks".

It's now so devoid of anything of interest that it's just a monotonous and odious chore to check it out.

Ditto with respect to The Bob Show ghost town.

Jack engineered his cult with his ignore list and phony BURY button such that he can gauge the whims of his least common denominators and maximize the contentment level of his loyal zombies. That's worked so well that nothing gets sent to "The Basement" anymore.

This sport is doomed to a track of ever increasing censorship, ostracism, corruption, stupidity, cluelessness, mediocrity, incompetence, danger, battlefield attrition.

The good news is that Kite Strings has achieved a critical mass and the hit counter rates have gone way up over the course of this season but I'm pretty sure that the best we'll be able to do for the foreseeable future is to educate a few triple digit IQ individuals and maybe prevent a few serious incidents. We'll never be any match for the dumbing down and ass covering machinery of The Industry Standard control freaks.

Yours Truly,
The Extremist One Percent

[Tad Eareckson]

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=3957
Things that make you laugh your ass off

michael170 - 2012/11/04 03:05:06 UTC

Davis Straub's faceplant.

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=27560
Do You Think It's Funny

Casey Cox - 2012/11/12 22:05:11 UTC

I saw I pic of Davis with a face plant on the thread of "Things that make you laugh your ass off", so I thought I would see how many pilots think that's funny.
---
Do you think it's funny to post pics of a fellow HG pilot getting hurt or having a potential bad accident?

Yes
No

- Funny? No. But something doesn't hafta be funny for me to really enjoy it.

- Not every asshole who flies hang gliders is a "fellow" or a "pilot". And Davis is neither.

- Is there some particular reason we should care more about some asshole who suffers the consequences of screwing the pooch in hang gliding than we should about someone who gets caught in the crossfire in Afghanistan, gets hit by a drunk driver, or gets a cancer diagnosis?

Ryan Voight - 2012/11/12 22:15:23 UTC

I was there for that incident...

Big surprise.

...and there was nothing funny about it. He was very lucky to not have broken his neck.

And that was a good thing for hang gliding, right?

I voted NO... that is one accident that I can't really laugh about after-the-fact.

What "accident"? Y'all were using dollies you KNEW were problematic and total shit for releases which you KNEW could only be of any use in circumstances in which everything is going right. And five months and a week from that clusterfuck on the opposite side of the planet the same combination - crap dollies and releases - is what's gonna get Robin killed behind "the best tow pilot in the business".

I think there's a line, at least for me, between when it's pilot error and we do something stupid ourselves... vs something very unfortunate happening to us.

Situations in which Hang Three and up flyers eat it because of something very unfortunate just happening to them are virtually nonexistent - and this one doesn't come anywhere close.

Casey Cox - 2012/11/12 22:18:23 UTC

If there are many pilots that feel this way... I wonder what it would take for SG to delete that pic/post?

Why focus on that being deleted and leave the crap that Ryan writes on instant hands free releases and unhooked launch issues intact?

I surely thought it was in bad taste to laugh at a fellow pilot's misfortune and would like the post/pic to be deleted.

Good, Casey. Because YOU disapprove of something you should work to make sure nobody else has the opportunity to see it.

Jason Boehm - 2012/11/12 22:22:51 UTC
Stapleton, Colorado

what happened?

Nothing that a halfway intelligent ten year old kid couldn't have seen coming from a mile away.

trnbrn - 2012/11/12 22:39:49 UTC
Greenacres, Washington

Love the anonymous (near crash, crash) videos for instructional purposes.

Yeah? Show me one that has had enough impact on hang gliding culture to catalyze any significant change for the better.

[Tad Eareckson]

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=27560
Do You Think It's Funny

Ryan Voight - 2012/11/12 22:50:13 UTC

Don't get me wrong... I laugh at people's misfortune all the time!

You ARE other people's misfortune, Ryan.

It's just THAT one I don't find funny.

Yeah, it sure is a bummer when a fellow cult member eats it.

I wouldn't ask SG to delete it, though... as much as I think Michael170 is a (I will not name call, I will not name call)... he's free to post what he likes, as are we all.

Yeah Ryan. We're ALL free...

No posts or links about Bob K, Scott C Wise, Tad Eareckson and related people, or their material. ALL SUCH POSTS WILL BE IMMEDIATELY DELETED. These people are poison to this sport and are permanently banned from this site in every possible way imaginable.

...to post whatever we like - just as long as we and our positions are approved by Jack.

If DAVIS asked for it to be removed, that would be different...

Fuck Davis.

Short story is some of the tow carts had issues with the castering front wheels. Probably compounded by towing uphill. Davis was not the only "victim" of those carts.

Yeah, what's that they say about doing the same thing over and over again and expecting better results?

I will say several people towed out of those carts without issue, as well... but it really could have just been luck and circumstance that it was an issue some times and not others...

Great way to run an airline. If you can just barely got away with doing something two thirds of the time then keep doing it and write the failures off as bad luck and circumstances.

Asshole.

Jason Boehm - 2012/11/12 22:54:54 UTC

so the cart just stopped and he took a header?

No, the cart just slowed down and he had no means of aborting the tow and took a header. If you wanna see one just stop you should probably spend some time at Florida Ridge.

Ryan Voight - 2012/11/12 23:03:23 UTC

Basically... too much drag from the cart and people were getting pulled too far through the control frame. (Or something like that.) It was a while ago, memory's a bit fuzzy.

It was definitely a castering cart wheel issue, that much I remember.

"Whoa! He just barely got away with that one... NEXT."

Dave Boggs - 2012/11/12 23:09:39 UTC

The poll needs that third option, "maybe"

It needs an "enjoyable" option.

Casey Cox - 2012/11/12 23:38:00 UTC

Well, every picture tells a story, but today we were talking about carts or mishaps or something and Davis's name got brought up that he had gotten hurt from a face plant off a cart. So when I saw the pic I thought that it had happened recently. Informing each other and learning from mishaps is one thing, but to post on a thread that we laugh at is another.

What do you think there was to LEARN about that incident? It was known at the time that the carts sucked and it's been known since the beginning of time that that kind of release configuration stinks on ice. The carts got fixed and everybody continues to fly with the shit releases 'cause we've got all the safety margin we really need.

Out of a couple thousand post or something, the only one I see of a pic of a pilot getting tumbled. My humor sometimes is not the best but mine I hope is not so blatant. I take pics all the time of other pilots at parks without asking them and I never post a pic that makes someone look bad or any injuries.

Too bad. When responsible reporters take and publish pics that make people look bad and show the consequences of their malfeasance there are much better prospects for getting people held accountable and problems fixed.

But that's just me.

Actually, that's pretty much everyone. Some go so far as to swallow the memory card.

If there is something to learn I would give the pic to the pilot and have them post the learning experience.

Maybe you should consider giving it to the flight park operator.

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=20756
How is Zach Etheridge doing?

Bob Flynn - 2011/02/04 11:26:34 UTC

Lookout keeps this kind of stuff under their hat. You never hear of accidents there. But every time I go there, I hear about quite a few. Blown launches, tree landings, etc.

Those guys are always looking for ways to improve their operations and educate the public.

[Tad Eareckson]

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=27560
Do You Think It's Funny

Davis Straub - 2012/11/12 23:42:30 UTC
Boise

The picture above is from my accident report.
http://ozreport.com/pub/fingerlakesaccident.shtml

From your stupidity report.

Jim Gaar - 2012/11/12 23:46:24 UTC

So how do you feel about your picture being posted and possibly laughed at?

Who gives a rat's ass?

Davis Straub - 2012/11/12 23:49:09 UTC

Another issue with coming off the cart when using a V-bridle:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZbvzqjcowY

11-1307
http://c2.staticflickr.com/2/1665/25540796840_8d23f4788c_o.png


http://ozreport.com/16.077
Why we love wheels

Yeah Davis. That was a consequence of flying with the deadly V-bridle. More people should learn to pro tow.

Davis Straub - 2012/11/12 23:51:18 UTC

Obviously I posted this stuff years ago and again now.

Yeah. And what with the remarkable advances made by the aerotowing industry in the eight years since all this stuff is pretty much totally irrelevant.

I could care less.

One could write volumes on the things you don't give rat's asses about.

I'm too old to worry about what some idiot in California thinks about me or my flying.

What flying? You got dragged off a cart and slammed into the ground and you call that FLYING and refer to OTHER people as idiots?

This incident had ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with FLYING. This issue issue was ENTIRELY about EQUIPMENT - the stuff you're SUPPOSED to get right BEFORE you go flying. The stuff neither you nor any of your asshole buddies is in any way qualified or fit to deal with.

If he wants to have a serious conversation, fine...

Sure Davis.

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=22660
What can be learned from this "scooter" towing accident?

Davis Straub - 2011/02/07 19:21:29 UTC

Okay, enough. On to new threads.

...but if he's going to act like the nincompoops who listen to Faux News, let him keep his head in the honey jar.

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=25015
Zippy pounds in

Davis Straub - 2011/09/02 18:37:09 UTC

Concussions are in fact very serious and have life long effects. The last time I was knocked out what in 9th grade football. I have felt the effects of that ever since. It changes your wiring.

Casey Cox - 2012/11/13 01:14:27 UTC

I should have known that Davis would have done a mishap analysis.

Yeah, Davis's "mishap" analyses are the best. Check out the crap he wrote about Robin's "mishap".

michael170 - 2012/11/13 02:24:00 UTC

And not one single word about the fact that he could not abort the tow.

Bullshit. He HAD a standard aerotow weak link and it did its job a millisecond after Davis's face plowed into the wing.

Paul Edwards - 2012/11/13 02:49:31 UTC
Tennessee

We can all look back at our own misfortune with a wry chuckle.

This has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with "misfortune", Paul.

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24534
It's a wrap

Davis Straub - 2011/07/30 19:51:54 UTC

I'm very happy with the way Quest Air (Bobby Bailey designed) does it now.

Both of you have gotten your faces rearranged because the way Quest Air (Bobby Bailey designed) does it now, has done it for over two decades, and will do it for the next two decades is to put people on the ends of strings and give them no option for aborting a tow when things start going south.

It's our right... we've earned it.

You had lotsa help earning it. And Davis has been a major player in that help machinery.

However to laugh at another's misfortune is a sad reflection on one's character (or lack thereof).

Well, you probably wouldn't think much of my character either. But if you had been working with me instead of the Davis/Quest assholes you'd still be getting equal amounts of air coming in through your...



...left and right nostrils.

It's nothing new though. The Laugh-your-ass-off thread is full of videos of people getting hurt. Does it make a difference if you don't know them personally?

I tend to give people I don't know personally the benefit of the doubt. Davis, however, I know personally - and I live for the day he locks out and breaks his fucking neck.

Or that they injured themselves doing something besides HG? We're a sadistic lot, no doubt about it.

What's more sadistic than selling people equipment with defects you know have killed people?

I'm no exception... I will laugh out load at the skate punk that lands on his balls... and a moment later I'll get highly offended at the shot of a little girl who gets creamed by a soccer ball to the face. It all depends on how close to home it hits I suppose.

For me it all depends on whether or not somebody deserves it or not. Somebody swerves to crush a Box Turtle on the side of the road and wraps his car around a telephone pole and bleeds to death I couldn't be much happier.

Davis, sounds like a crappy day man.

Crappy day for Davis, great day for hang gliding.

Ryan Voight - 2012/11/13 02:49:52 UTC

Yup, while getting pulled forward through the bar (and resisting the pull with his arms) he could have let go and reached for the release. That would have insured a good outcome

THAT'S THE POINT...

Gregg B. McNamee - 1996/12

If your system requires you to take your hand off the control bar to actuate the release it is not suitable.

...SHITHEAD.

That would have insured a good outcome.

We HAD a good outcome. Not as good as Davis getting his fucking neck broken - but thirteen stitches in the lip is better than nothing.

Glenn Zapien - 2012/11/13 02:50:52 UTC

I believe in karma.

Ryan Voight - 2012/11/13 02:56:52 UTC

Then what's coming to the guy who has no compassion for someone's misfortune, through no fault of their own?

Yeah Ryan. He gets on a cart with a known and significant problem using Industry Standard "releases" that stink on ice and gets his face rearranged and it's a misfortune suffered through no fault of his own.

After flying a meet- 7 out of 7 days- against Davis, I have to say I have a lot of respect for him. *I* was hurting, tired, sore... after day 3... Davis had a smile on his face and a bounce in his step every day. Some days he did better than others, but unlike me or Dustin, there was no pouting about it.

Respect.

Yeah, physical endurance. What better reason to respect someone.
Me... I enjoy visiting children's oncology centers so I can piss all over little girls getting chemoed for leukemia.

If you don't know him, haven't flown with him, don't be so judgmental.

I know him - and I don't five a flying fuck about his flying.

If you are basing your opinion of him off of what a guy called "cockroach" says happened years ago... well... yea.

We don't need to base our opinions of him off of what a guy called "cockroach" says happened years ago. We've got a nice written record to show what a total piece of shit he is.

Glenn Zapien - 2012/11/13 03:07:28 UTC

You have alot of knowledge about Hang Gliding Ryan.

The vast majority of it bogus and clueless.

But it takes a lot more than that for me to respect you or anyone else.

I'd hafta get my decency centers surgically removed before I could develop any respect for Davis or Ryan.

Zeph - 2012/11/13 03:11:33 UTC
Iowa

Davis, Thanks for the lengthy write up on the incident.

Minus one single word about the fact that he could not abort the tow.

Good of you to do under a "hostile" environment this thread kind of is.

Yeah, it's a real bummer that he can't just delete posts, lock down threads, and ban people to soften the battlefield the way he does on his own forum.

Trying to help people understand and stay safe after an oops is a cool thing.

Yeah Davis. You should think about giving something like that a try sometime - instead of doing the precise opposite.

JJ Coté - 2012/11/13 03:26:41 UTC

OK, so here's the elephant in the room: the caption says "Davis Straub's faceplant." If this was an anonymous pilot lying face-down attached to a whacked glider next to a tow dolly, would it be considered laugh-your-ass-off funny?

You'd hafta no the background of the planter. Some helpless victim of Florida Ridge like Sheryl Zayas - quite the opposite. A more than deserving piece of shit like Davis - go for it.

Or is this schadenfreude because it's Davis?

Because of who and what Davis is.

(Yes, those are rhetorical questions. And not just because it was a Rhettorical tow.)

[Tad Eareckson]

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=27560
Do You Think It's Funny

Paul Hurless - 2012/11/13 03:34:14 UTC

michael170 - 2012/11/13 02:24:00 UTC

And not one single word about the fact that he could not abort the tow.

Ok, Tad wannabe...

Ooh, a Tad wannabe... Are those still allowed to post on The Jack Show?

...how would you abort a tow while still on a cart???

Incredible that this sport is so deep in the sewer that a question like that gets asked.

Let's hear some of your expertise on the subject.

Fuck that. I wanna hear some of YOUR expertise on the subject...

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=11998
Tad Report...

Paul Hurless - 2009/05/15 01:43:43 UTC

Yes, I can do better. It took me all of 2 minutes to come up with a simple (darn, the KISS principal keeps popping up) system that only has two moving parts; the cord to actuate it and the actual release that holds onto the tow line. It's almost completely internal in the control bar and a downtube, only emerging at the control bar for the hand to actuate it and at the top of the downtube where it goes to the release mechanism. No pulleys, springs, or bungees needed. If you are doubting me I could send you a sketch.
Have a nice day.

Paul Hurless - 2009/05/15 03:02:47 UTC

I'll have to draw it out legibly and then scan it so it may be a day or so.

...ya useless fuckin' worm.

michael170 - 2012/11/13 04:38:21 UTC

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rh3-uZptNw0

Stephan Mentler - 2012/11/13 04:54:33 UTC
Pensacola

Davis,

I remember seeing the launch that your link points to, at the Rob Kells Memorial. What do you think occurred?

What do YOU...

michael170 - 2012/08/17 17:01:40 UTC

Zack, let me see if I understand your logic.

You had a thing and it broke needlessly.
You didn't want the thing to break needlessly.
You replaced the thing with a stronger thing.
Now the thing doesn't break needlessly.

...think occurred?

What would you have done differently to come out of the cart a little more cleanly?

Yeah, that's the problem. He didn't come out of the cart cleanly enough.

I remember the conditions were a bit rowdy getting out of the Ridge and there were a number of weak link breaks, etc.

No...

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=6911
Sunday flying at Florida ridge. -

Socrates Zayas - 2008/05/21 23:53:23 UTC

The cycle was nice, nothing out of the ordinary, but just as the tug flew over the fence line of the orchard the weak link broke. It was as if it didn't even break - Eric and I both thought it was a release malfunction.

...shit.

I ask as I try to learn from other people's experiences.

Learn some theory - asshole.

Paul Hurless - 2012/11/13 05:02:15 UTC

No, I said "your" expertise, not someone else's. You're so quick to jump in with the BS comments, how about something with substance that you are personally familiar with?

Lessee...

If a supertanker running in a flat calm and unlimited visibility drives out of a well marked channel and up onto the rocks and soaks thirteen hundred miles of Prince William Sound coastline in oil Michael's not qualified to comment on it 'cause he's never driven a supertanker in Prince William Sound.

Or will you just keep parroting someone else's rants?

Fuck you Paul. My parrot (who just got charged by the Cooper's Hawk again) has ten times your IQ and problem solving ability.

Robert Moore - 2012/11/13 05:03:49 UTC

I don't really get the humor of this specific incident. Davis is Davis - warts and all...

Davis is Davis - all warts.

...but I've never got the impression he thinks he is impervious to the potential risks in this sport.

This had absolutely nothing to do with the inherent risks of the sport. It was all shoddy equipment and piss poor decision making.

He actually seems alot better than the typical pilot in pointing out his own mistakes and mishaps.

He's not a pilot and what he's really good at is promoting and protecting incompetent negligent douchebags like Bobby and the deadly junk with which they flood the market.

As the victim of a potentially serious towing accident myself, (Thank you, MC helmet!) I'm pretty sensitive to others who've had a similar experience.

- How 'bout telling us about it?
- On the other hand, if it actually WAS an experience similar to Davis's there really isn't a goddam thing to be learned from it.

I wouldn't laugh at anyone who's gone through it.

Motherfucker got a tiny little piece of what he deserved.

Paul Hurless - 2012/11/13 05:05:56 UTC

Most of us wouldn't, either, RM.

Nah, most of you assholes are to busy pushing "Sink This!" buttons on and sabotaging anybody who's developed antidotes to Industry Standard equipment and procedures.

Rodger Hoyt - 2012/11/13 05:15:43 UTC

Thirteen stitches? NOT FUNNY!
I sure appreciate the OZ Report and am glad Davis wasn't hurt so he can keep posting it!

Yeah, keep reading the garbage Davis posts. And don't forget the excellent book, Towing Aloft, by Dennis Pagen and Bill Bryden. If you enjoy Davis you'll be ecstatic about that crap.

[Tad Eareckson]

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=27560
Do You Think It's Funny

Davis Straub - 2012/11/13 06:21:01 UTC

michael170 - 2012/11/13 02:24:00 UTC

And not one single word about the fact that he could not abort the tow.

Sorry that my report from eight years ago was not thorough enough for you.

It was PLENTY thorough enough for us Davis. It showed us all just how dedicated you are to making sure the primary factor that precipitated your stupid crash wouldn't get identified or discussed.

Since then I have published numerous articles on mouth releases...

- You were towing two point. So how come we're not gonna hear a single word on the issue of two point releases which allow one to blow tow with both hands on the basetube? Is it because doing so would tip even some of the Jack Show morons off to the fact that if you had just mounted the fucking brake lever on the basetube instead of the downtube you could've prevented the crash and saved yourself a trip to the emergency room?

- Yes. You've PUBLISHED numerous ARTICLES on "MOUTH" releases - including the one on Steve Kinsley's multi-string which you sabotaged so you could discount it as not viable and continue selling your bent pin barrel shit.

- And you've bent over backwards to sabotage the discussions...

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=15571
Pro/Tow release from base tube
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=15684
Pro-Tow Mouth Release
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=16249
Mouth Release . . . Here we go again

...of other people who are trying to do what they can to optimize their chances of surviving a towing career.

- So how:
-- many:
--- people adopted any of these releases as a result of the articles you published?
--- Flight Park Mafia franchises have made them available to their marks or endorsed them?
-- come they all sucked so bad that you continued using and selling your bent pin barrel shit?

...which hopefully if I had used one I could have managed to operate successfully at that time.

Yes. Which HOPEFULLY you could have MANAGED to operate successfully at that time.

All of them operate by either:
- biting
- relaxing a bite
- tugging a string
- tugging and releasing a string

So let's talk about MANAGING to operate them successfully to give the idiot Jack Show readers the impression that these are all really iffy propositions and they're probably better off sticking with the tried and true Quest crap which requires the pilot to keep his hands on the basetube until the weak link blows on impact.

The first five seconds of a cart based aerotow are by far the most dangerous and after that releasing with a barrel release is probably a better idea.

Yeah. After the first five seconds you're out of the kill zone and there's NO problem with having to reach for a barrel...

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24846
Is this a joke ?

Marc Fink - 2011/08/28 21:11:09 UTC

I once locked out on an early laminarST aerotowing. went past vertical and past 45 degrees to the line of pull-- and the load forces were increasing dramatically. The weaklink blew and the glider stalled--needed every bit of the 250 ft agl to speed up and pull out. I'm alive because I didn't use a stronger one.

Dennis Pagen - 2005/01

I didn't want to release, because I was so close to the ground and I knew that the glider would be in a compromised attitude. In addition, there were hangars and trees on the left, which is the way the glider was tending.

By the time we gained about sixty feet I could no longer hold the glider centered - I was probably at a twenty degree bank - so I quickly released before the lockout to the side progressed. The glider instantly whipped to the side in a wingover maneuver.

http://www.ozreport.com/9.133
Lesson from an aerotow accident report

Steve Wendt - 2005/05/29

The basebar hit the ground first, nose wires failed from the impact, and at the same time she was hitting face first.

...or any other kind...

Joe Gregor - 2004/09

There is no evidence that the pilot made an attempt to release from tow prior to the weak link break, the gate was found closed on the Wallaby-style tow release.

...of release.

So explain to me, Davis...

...and after that releasing with a barrel release is probably a better idea.

How come it's EVER "PROBABLY" a better idea to take a hand off the basetube?

Manned Kiting
The Basic Handbook of Tow Launched Hang Gliding
by Daniel F. Poynter
1974

"Never take your hands off the bar." - Tom Peghiny

At what point in the history of hang glider towing did taking a hand off the basetube become a GOOD thing?

I think that Julia had a mouth release but maybe not.

Which is relevant to the discussion how? But let's just throw that in there to leave the impression that there's probably no significant safety advantage to any of these devices.

Asshole.

[Tad Eareckson]

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=27560
Do You Think It's Funny

Ryan Voight - 2012/11/13 06:33:31 UTC

Michael- that video was posted March 2 of this year. I do not think Davis could have seen it in 2004 or whenever it was!

EDIT: dang, Davis beat me to it!

- Yeah Ryan, in 2004 there were NO OPTIONS for...

British Hang Gliding and Paragliding Association Technical Manual - 2003/04

On tow the Pilot in Command must have his hand actually on the release at all times. 'Near' the release is not close enough! When you have two hands completely full of locked-out glider, taking one off to go looking for the release guarantees that your situation is going to get worse before it gets better.

...configuring a glider - one point like he wasn't towing or two point like he was - such that the pilot could release without taking a hand off the basetube. He couldn't have put his Quallaby brake lever on the basetube or used a Lockout Release. Granted, both of those releases totally suck - but a fifty percent chance of actuation is a helluva lot better than the zero percent chance of actuation Davis actually had.

- So that video was posted March 2 of this year. So in the seven and a half months since it was posted has Davis replaced the bent pin Quest crap on his shoulders? Or is he still using - and selling and...

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24534
It's a wrap

Davis Straub - 2011/07/30 19:51:54 UTC

I'm very happy with the way Quest Air (Bobby Bailey designed) does it now.

...promoting - the same crap he was using for his faceplant?

- So you're saying that if that video had been posted seven and a half months prior to his faceplant he'd have equipped himself with the Remote Barrel Release *I* developed.

- So you're saying that if Davis had equipped himself with the Remote Barrel Release *I* developed that this incident...

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=3957
Things that make you laugh your ass off

Ryan Voight - 2012/11/12 22:15:23 UTC

I was there for that incident and there was nothing funny about it. He was very lucky to not have broken his neck.

...which we ALL AGREE...

The crash was quite loud and many people felt that much worse had happened to me. It easily could have if I had hit the keel with my head. I swung through and didn't really hit the ground with my head. I could easily have had much worse injuries.

...could EASILY have resulted in the sonuvabitch breaking his fuckin' neck could've been totally and easily defused.

- So Davis is in a situation in which he...

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=14230
pro tow set-up

Ryan Voight - 2009/11/03 05:24:31 UTC

Have you never pondered what you would do in a situation where you CAN'T LET GO to release? I'd purposefully break the weaklink, as described above. Instant hands free release

...CAN'T LET GO to release.

I'd purposefully break the weaklink, as described above. Instant hands free release

So how come he doesn't just purposefully break the weak link, as described above? How come he doesn't just actuate his instant hands free release?

- So why do you think...

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=14230
pro tow set-up

Ryan Voight - 2009/11/03 20:51:52 UTC

My whole point is that people tend to "hang on" too long trying to save things, rather than recognize a bad situation and release (one way or another), go back, and reset.

...he "hung on" too long trying to save things, rather than recognizing a bad situation and releasing (one way or another), going back, and resetting?

- So can we now agree...

We should go towing some time... I can teach you how to break weaklinks intentionally, before things get too bad... then you can show me how you put things in your mouth

...that only total fucking douchebags maintain this bullshit position of being able to break weaklinks intentionally, before things get too bad?

- So now you're gonna start using and advising your students and other Jack Show assholes to use the Remote Barrel Release *I* developed?

(Smartass useless little shit.)

[Steve Davy]

I think of Ryan as a smartass less than useless little punk. But "Smartass useless little shit" works for me.

[Tad Eareckson]

How 'bout "smartass less than useless little punk shit"? Does that cover enough of the bases?

[Steve Davy]

I'm thinking the smartass less than useless little punk shit is well on his way to earning himself a dedicated thread over here.