Karen Schenck? (I think)
Think you have enough exclamation points there, Rodie?Jim Gaar - 2013/04/02 15:51:10 UTC
HOLY shit where was the guy in the back looking!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
He didn't need to look over the hook-in!!! The hook-in's fine!!! It's really tough to launch unhooked from platform.Why did he not look over the hookin!!!
The hook-UP however was a bit problematic.
In your fuckin' idiot vile little world...In MY WORLD that is his/her PRIMARY job.
- polypro towline
- bent pin barrel releases
- Marzec Links
- Matt Taber
- Jim Rooney
...are all just fine.
You're just hearing about this one?WTF people...
Yeah, I think everybody had that pretty well figured out by 0:54.There was plenty of time for the pilot to get himself off but that's one time I would have cut the line or at the very least dumped pressure.
No shit, Sherlock.This SHOULD NOT BE HAPPENING!
Yeah Brad...Brad Barkley - 2013/04/02 16:01:30 UTC
Totally agree.
http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1157
Accident information please.
Bill Cummings - 2013/02/12 02:24:20 UTC
The cause of the accident is posted below the video by son Scott.
Thanks Scott and Bob B. This may well save pilots from the same accident.
Warren Narron - 2013/02/12 02:24:20 UTC
This is not really an accident.
This is hard to watch.
Who is the winch operator?
Warren Narron - 2013/02/12 03:09:12 UTC
Bob may try to take all the blame for this but that's not the way I see it.
Bob knew he was in trouble long before the 'safety' man in the truck knew it.
If he had a release that would have worked without taking his hands off the control bar, he could have saved himself. I can't imagine how long it must have seemed waiting for the safety man to cut him some slack...
I don't think there's a whole lot of disagreement on this one. So what's that helping?Warren Narron - 2013/02/13 02:19:21 UTC
Ok, I'm walking back my previous knee jerk comment. I regret and am sorry for pointing fingers of blame as it's now come out that these were build partners of a new system and the winch man wasn't any more experienced than Bob. I was reading into the story that Bob was getting instruction from an established operator. This was a horrible mistake and ultimately Bob the pic, paid the price. I wish him the best in recovery.
There, but for the grace of God, go I.
I'm sticking with my other comments about the obvious piece of crap release Bob was using.
If he could have released without taking his hands off the basetube, this disaster could have been averted.
Bull fucking shit. A ten year old kid who'd never been near a glider before could've handled that one if he had just been watching the glider.And it depends so much on the skill and experience of the operator.
Talked to Holly Korzilius...I have truck towed dozens and dozens of times with Steve Wendt at Blue Sky, and never have even come close to having an issue, or known anyone with any kind of safety issue on tow.
http://www.chgpa.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=587
Holly's Accident
...about that?Scott Wilkinson - 2005/05/30 03:16:49 UTC
At an altitude somewhere between fifty and a hundred feet (we don't know for sure) there was a lockout situation with the glider at a near ninety degree angle. When a line broke (I don't know which one), Holly's glider recoiled backwards, almost fully inverted, then partially recovered in a dive toward the ground.
Steve saw Holly pulling in for speed. He speculated had she been ten to twenty feet higher, she might have made it... and ten to twenty feet lower, she could have died. Whatever the case, she hit the ground hard at something less than a vertical angle. Her Charly Insider full-face helmet was broken through in two places (the chin and next to her eye), and Steve believes the breaks absorbed some of the impact and probably saved her life.
Based purely on my experience at Blue Sky, truck towing feels to me like the safest and easiest way to get airborne.
Zack C - 2011/03/04 05:29:28 UTC
As for platform launching, I was nervous about it when I started doing it. It looked iffy, like things could get bad fast. I've since logged around a hundred platform launches and have seen hundreds more. Never once was there any issue. I now feel platform launching is the safest way to get a hang glider into the air (in the widest range of conditions). You get away from the ground very quickly and don't launch until you have plenty of airspeed and excellent control.
In a platform tow the bridle is routed UNDER the basetube. This does not count as a platform tow.But again, that probably depends on the operator, as we see in the horrifying video above.
Thanks for pointing that out, Nate.Nate Wreyford - 2013/04/02 16:25:35 UTC
Austin
In the vid above, PIC had a major role. Pre-flight fail and failure to just get off tow!
I couldn't agree more about it feeling safe and being easy.
I love using a winch to get up.
Bullshit.Mike Badley - 2013/04/02 17:03:42 UTC
Ahhhh... $$##$$))H!!!
That really does look like what probably happened to Karen. Calling for more pressure would have REALLY made it worse.
Bullshit. You get the tension required to sustain a glider in flight misaligned enough, it's gonna lock out.I am not looking at that as a true 'lockout' which I think is more classically too high brake pressure and an extremely high angle of attack followed by the involuntary wingover slam as the glider stalls out.
A lockout.What is this called then??
And once the "hooked-in" box has been checked the pilot is assumed to be hooked in from that point on until he lands, crashes, or is observed dangling from the basetube - whichever comes first.We always use a pre-flight checklist when platform towing that has 'dialogue' between pilot and tow vehicle operators. That checklist would have included checking the tow line 'under' the bar with the release set up right by the TOW operator - because it is a 'check' against something the pilot originally did. The pilot would check the disk pressure and nose release because that is something the TOW operator did. Cross checking each other makes for 'non-events'. Footlaunching requires radio checklist with driver.
Why should that matter? You always do and your driver always requires and observes...I admit that one time I got so distracted by a wuffo asking me tons of questions while I was setting up the bridle connection to the tow rope that I completely forgot to hook in.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2haXF9y7BWI
Scooter Towing the Moyes Ventura
Sparkozoid - 2012/11/28
dead
...a hook-in check, right?
Guess not.The end result was that I ran until I couldn't run any further, flopped down on my belly which pulled the link-knife (because it is attached to my harness) and watched my glider float up for a bit before settling back to earth. For a moment I did not connect the dots and thought it was so strange seeing my glider fly off without me.
And THAT WAY you make it perfectly safe for everybody to skip doing and requiring...After that - I added the "HOOKED IN" part to the verbal checklist prior to the "TAKE UP SLACK" command to the driver.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u51qpPLz5U0
06-0818
07-0913
08-0924
09-0929
10-1003
11-1118
...hook-in checks!
But the glider drifting off to starboard, locking out, and slamming in is perfectly OK.I can see how this looks like the drum pressure is set wrong on the launch because the glider doesn't climb out. So the tow operator doesn't see the problem and dump pressure.
Right Dave. This total asshole just thought he could fix a bad thing and didn't want to start over. Nothing to do with him needing BOTH hands to fly the glider in that situation and the release lanyard being "within easy reach".It sure looks like the pilot had plenty of time to ABORT tow by pulling the release, but his lack of tows didn't make him cognizant of the problem and he fights for control rather than just pinning-off.
Well I'm absolutely positive you'd have done JUST FINE in that situation, Michael.Man, when I find myself skimming the ground instead of climbing out, I don't wait - I just pull the release and float down for another try.
