landing

General discussion about the sport of hang gliding
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Tad Eareckson
Posts: 9161
Joined: 2010/11/25 03:48:55 UTC

Re: landing

Post by Tad Eareckson »

Jump to next post:
http://www.kitestrings.org/post5846.html#p5846

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=30722
What happened to JD?
NMERider - 2014/02/27 19:01:23 UTC

Now let's take another incident. Let's look at the seven mile glide I did down a series of ravines only to clear the last hurdle by fifty feet. And even then I had no proper bailout field, yet I kept my cool and glided out low over a housing development until I spotted a nice dirt field and nailed an excellent landing.
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Tom Lyon - 2014/02/04 07:55:19 UTC

In learning to fly the sailplanes, I had it drilled into me that below two hundred feet, my options did not include anything more than maybe a very slight turn to avoid hitting an obstacle. Like thirty degrees from my heading maybe. A slight bank.
Thomas Lyon - 80560 - H2 - 2013/06/17 - Jennifer Copple, Lockout Mountain Flight Park - FL CL FSL
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The Long, Low Glide Out
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNYWlVQj2eU
Glide On - 2013/12/10
dead

2012/06/12
From:
Running Springs launch
To:
34°06'44.71" N 117°09'10.96" W

Jump to top:
http://www.kitestrings.org/post5844.html#p5844
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Tad Eareckson
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Joined: 2010/11/25 03:48:55 UTC

Re: landing

Post by Tad Eareckson »

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=30929
Doha! My worst landing ever, caught on tape
Erik Delf - 2014/03/27 16:49:02 UTC

Step 1: Get upwind
2014/03/27 22:19:23 UTC - 3 thumbs up - NMERider
2014/03/27 18:12:59 UTC - 3 thumbs up - Brian Scharp
Yeah guys, that post was mostly on target about the right way to do this. So did you also wanna take a stand on any or all of the total crap that's been written in this thread?
michael170 - 2014/03/28 02:54:30 UTC

Tom asked about switching winds and that reminded me of an incident I had at Funston in 2010.

At the time of my launch the wind was a bit south, then about an hour and a half into the flight I noticed the wind had switched to a bit north. A few minutes later it was south again and this went on for, let's say, half an hour. Well now I'm thinking this could make the landing interesting, I better come up with a strategy to deal with the situation.

Landing at the Fort is bit easier and probably safer when it's straight in or a little south rather than north, plus one can land closer to the setup area. I know I'll just wait for another south cycle, which were every five minutes or so, then I'll set up and land.

Sure enough, a few minutes go by and it's southy again as I fly south in front of launch and have a look at the streamers in the LZ. Perfect, except I'm not high enough to do a 270 approach. No problem, I'll just continue south, turn around, and do a base to final as I often like to anyway.

At some point after I had noted the south wind and my turn to final, the wind (you guessed it) had switched north again and I completely failed to notice. If just after, or - better yet - before, I had turned to final I had noticed the switch I could have easily made the adjustment and missed the bush rotor.
Brian Horgan - 2014/03/29 04:58:27 UTC

more speed.
How 'bout more Frisbees? Couldn't we have Frisbees sprinkled all over the field so that people could both land safely and build up fantastic records on accuracy?
Chris Kelcourse - 2014/03/29 11:57:07 UTC

Wow. Didn't realize this would spark such discussion guys. I appreciate all the good advice.
Can you identify what the good advice is so's people can discard the total crap? 'Cause otherwise there's never much benefit to these.
I know plenty of guys that make mistakes on video and delete immediately.
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=21647
Busted Shoulder
Allen Sparks - 2011/04/24 20:45:49 UTC

Location: Lookout Mountain, Golden Colorado, LZ
Date 4/23/2011
Damage to pilot: <edit> torn bicep, torn supraspinatus tendon (rotator cuff)
Damage to glider: None
A few contributing factors in no significant order. Eliminating any one of these might have changed the outcome.
- no wheels
- glider trimmed too slow
- late transition to uprights
- insufficient airspeed on approach
This injury was avoidable

busted shoulder
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AEICgGVJdSs
Sparkozoid - 2011/04/24
dead
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=30722
What happened to JD?
NMERider - 2014/02/04 05:01:31 UTC

Here is what I have from Wednesday's flight until the last three seconds which I could not recover from the file fragments.

What A Beautiful Day It Was...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHLDLk-Dr90
Glide On - 2014/02/03
dead
I hope this will encourage those people to post those videos.
Hopefully it will encourage to put some BACK UP - 'specially the ones that disappeared before I figured out how to download them.
We can't help each other identify ways to improve watching each other's highlights.
Y'all can't do shit in the way learning from untold reams of...

http://vimeo.com/16572582

password - "red"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJV_t4L92pE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYe3YmdIQTM

Aerotow launch faliure
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bj-qBsETXPg
Oliver Chitty - 2014/03/02
dead
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vaTu5Y4WBdY

18-3704
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-36aQ3Hg33c


...total fucking disasters.

Neither do you seem to be able to learn shit from videos of:
- Eric Hinrichs and Chris Valley doing hook-in checks
- Zack C not using standard aerotow weak links
- NewMikha blowing tow in a lockout with both hands on the basetube
- Dave Seib and Brian Foster doing tight approaches
- Steve Pearson staying on the fucking basetube until the glider's almost out of steam
- Bob Grant, Doug Prather, Niki Longshore rolling in on the wheels
so I won't waste the time and bandwidth on this reponse.
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: landing

Post by Tad Eareckson »

http://www.chgpa.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=3173
somewhat predictable accident at Highland
Allen Sparks - 2008/04/19 01:38:55 UTC
Evergreen, Colorado

A week ago, a new pilot to the area muffed an approach and transition to the uprights and ended up pounding in (without wheels) .. the noseplate nailed him squarely in the back of the helmet, but fortunately, without injury. I really doubt that wheels would have made any difference, unless they were monster 12" pneumatics.
Image
http://ozreport.com/pub/images/babymother.jpg
Image

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=34886
Don't hit the baby

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=34948
Don't hit the baby, the report
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: landing

Post by Tad Eareckson »

What A Beautiful Day It Was...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHLDLk-Dr90
NMERider - 2014/02/03
This video is unavailable.
Sorry about that.
Well, not to me it isn't.

A collection of representative stills from the download:

01-00511
- 01 - chronological order
- -0 - minutes
- 05 - seconds
- 11 - frame (30 fps)

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From the last time Jonathan's foot contacts the ground on the Marshall launch to the last good frame of recovered video before he slams into the AJX putting green - 2014/01/29 - courtesy of his safety device.

That may be the end of an important flying career. And, of course / as usual it wasn't as a consequence of an XC landing in a hazardous environment...

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=26847
Landing Out
NMERider - 2012/08/10 17:09:10 UTC

Be glad you don't fly XC where I do. It really sucks here in the LA Basin and I'm tired of all the hazards.
It was as a consequence of practicing to foot land in Jonathan's hazardous environments - the overwhelming majority of which were undoubtedly safely wheel landable.

Pretty sad. What a waste.
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: landing

Post by Tad Eareckson »

http://www.kitestrings.org/post5844.html#p5844
2014/03/29 03:46:30 UTC

I post stills from one of the many videos of Jonathan's that I've archived before he's killed them - in this case:

The Long, Low Glide Out
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Zsc74g_yos
NMERider - 2013/12/10
dead

And ON THE SAME DAY - I've just discovered - it reappeared under a new URL:

The Long, Low Glide Out
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sIYJgAtcVGc
Glide On - 2014/03/29
dead

Coincidence?

Jonathan... Try to stay on your meds the OTHER half of the time 'cause when you're on an even keel you're capable of making some positive contributions to the sport.
---
Edit - 2014/10/10 10:55:00 UTC

Yet another URL:

The Long, Low Glide Out
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNYWlVQj2eU
Glide On - 2013/12/10
dead
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: landing

Post by Tad Eareckson »

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=37329
2014 Pre-Worlds accident report

Landing at high altitude (Valle de Bravo, Mexico)
Miguel Gutierrez - 2014/04/28

1. - Overview: During the initial safety meeting and, throughout the meet, organizers advised pilots to put special attention on landings.
Did anybody advise anybody to use safe wheels? Just kidding.
This, due to the inherent risky conditions consistent with a high altitude mountainous place like Valle de Bravo.
A little over six grand. Big fuckin' deal.
Winds were shifty, and landing zones small and scarce.
Complaints of turbulence - especially inside the launch/start cylinder, were frequent. Although no in-air collisions or tumbles occurred.
We also saw the abandonment of pilots due to the unsatisfactory safety conditions of the area.
Good move.
Finally, and as was expected, several bad landings happened.
In a foot landing culture when is that NOT a pretty safe bet?
Broken down bars, for instance, were in the two digit mark, but this is only speculation.
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30971
Zach Marzec
Jim Rooney - 2013/02/28 01:17:55 UTC

Well said Billo
I'm a bit sick of all the armchair experts telling me how my friend died.

Ah but hg'ers get so uppity when you tell them not to speculate.
Valle de Bravo presents an environment demanding of the highest skill level.
Especially when the ambient judgment level totally sucks.
Reason for which - we consider, the competition was very first rate and extremely technical.

2. - Safety: The organization, through the support of local, regional, and federal government, provided more than sufficient elements to guarantee an expedited attention to injured pilots.
Pound of cure.
3. - Summary of injured pilots: All injuries took place upon landing...
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=22176
Paragliding Collapses
Jim Rooney - 2011/06/12 13:57:58 UTC

Most common HG injury... spiral fracture of the humerus.
Gil Dodgen - 1995/01

All of this reminds me of a comment Mike Meier made when he was learning to fly sailplanes. He mentioned how easy it was to land a sailplane (with spoilers for glide-path control and wheels), and then said, "If other aircraft were as difficult to land as hang gliders no one would fly them."
...and were attended on site with an ambulance, and in severe cases were transported to different health institutions depending on the type of insurance covering the pilot.

Day 1. - Kathleen Rigg: Experienced pilot, had flown Valle de Bravo previously, had a bad flare, resulting in a sprained wrist.
Narrow dry riverbed with large rocks strewn all over the place, right?
She subsequently decided to not fly any more.
A great time was had by all.
Day 3. - Particularly turbulent day.

Incident 1. - Rob Gregg, of Great Britain, attempted to land on what from the sky looked like a rather inviting field, was surprised to find out it was a peach plantation... overshooting such field anyway, eventually coming to a stop hitting a fence. Taken to Valle de Bravo on an ambulance, to undergo surgery the next day under the French team's doctor. For obvious reasons did not continue to fly the competition.
Did they check...

Image

...his testicles for any problems in the magnitude and multitude departments?
Incident 2. - Sun Gun Mo, South Korean pilot, only spoke Korean...
Sum ting wong, wi tu lo, ho lee fuk, bang ding ow.
...landed near a waypoint in an ample field according to his track log, which we analyzed, set up a proper approach, to then veer of course and finally crash with the left side of his helmet. This account was from local bystanders, since the pilot did not remember the final moments of the event. His gear upon inspection revealed no apparent damage to his helmet, and his glider only suffered a broken down tube.

Although his injury was minor, he presented a small hemorrhage from an ear, that and the fact that he spoke no English or Spanish and was in a considerable pain, led local safety and rescue authorities to demand a helicopter extraction to a bigger and more specialized hospital in Toluca City, and although he did not have any type of medical insurance, was given high priority upon arrival. He was cleared from the hospital the next day with a couple of stitches on his chin.

Incident 3. - Gabriel Lagos, local pilot, had a bad...
...attempted standup...
...landing...
...on a wheel friendly putting green...
...and had a blow to his wrist, attended on site by an ambulance to subsequently decide to have his driver take him to a private hospital of his preference where an x-ray revealed a fissure to his right radius bone. Did not continue in the competition.

Day 4 & 5. - Manuel Rivero and Rodrigo Alva suffered cuts in their legs with no consequences other than stitches, both continued to fly the rest of the meet.

4. - Summary:
- Kathleen Rigg, GBR, 20 - 2014/03/01 - sprained wrist - Landing Ambulance - rest, complete recovery
- Rob Gregg, GBR, 31 - 2014/03/03 - broken left humerus - Landing Ambulance - surgery, complete recovery
- Sun Gun Mo, South Korea, 38 - 2014/03/03 - jaw impact, mild concussion - Landing Helicopter extraction - stitches, complete recovery
- Gabriel Lagos, Mexico - 2014/03/03 - sprained wrist - Landing Ambulance - complete recovery
- Manuel Rivero, Mexico - 2014/03/04 - cut to the leg - Landing Ambulance - stitches, complete recovery
- Rodrigo Alva, Mexico - 2014/03//05 - cut to the leg - Landing - complete recovery

In conclusion, launch and flight portions presented no safety issues. Very thorough hang checks were performed before launch...
...after which everyone could safely assume everyone was connected to his glider...
...and aggressive pilots were approached and warned. In-cloud flying was not reported...
It so seldom is.
...although flying close to base was sometimes witnessed.
Kinda hard to witness people who've gone into the clouds, isn't it?
Controlled airspaces were utilized, but to the awareness of the authorities. No serious incidents were reported.
Broken humeri and mild concussions not being considered serious crash consequences, of course - especially when the happen to somebody else.
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: landing

Post by Tad Eareckson »

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=31663
Wheel census
NMERider - 2013/04/10 20:51:38 UTC

I prefer the WW aluminum hubs with the VG tunnel, even on my Falcon. The hubs are very precise and if lubricated with Teflon roll very freely and don't chew up the control bar since they are locked in place with set screws. I plan on making a modified WW aluminum speedbar with a round 1-1/8" section so I can use these wheels to land my T2C. I prefer this lubricant:

http://www.amazon.com/Dupont-Multi-Use-Lubricant-oz-Spray/dp/B000GL19TY

The WW AL hub: p/n# 70M-1027
http://www.willswing.com/Accessories/wheels_main.asp
$30.00 per wheel. A worthwhile investment.

Image
I like the way you configure with the valve stem inboard and uncapped.

Image

Forget the wheels, Jonathan. Stick with drag chutes.
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: landing

Post by Tad Eareckson »

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=37419
HG / PG the saga might not continue ?
Dontsink - 2014/05/09 10:39:46 UTC

Here in Spain there are a lot of HG pilots who also fly PG's.
For morning sled rides, hike and fly or when simply feeling too lazy to carry and rig the HG.
On the other hand most PG pilots really like how HG's fly but will never give it a try.
Too much hard work and scary landings.
Well Mike...
Gil Dodgen - 1995/01

All of this reminds me of a comment Mike Meier made when he was learning to fly sailplanes. He mentioned how easy it was to land a sailplane (with spoilers for glide-path control and wheels), and then said, "If other aircraft were as difficult to land as hang gliders no one would fly them."
Looks like no one's flying them. But don't worry, you guys sell paragliders too - so no skin off YOUR noses.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fuMxK9PadzA


http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=22176
Paragliding Collapses
Jim Rooney - 2011/06/12 13:57:58 UTC

Most common HG injury... spiral fracture of the humerus.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_2holKUTxM

34-12413
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Those fucking IDIOT foot landings have DEEE *MOLISHED* this sport.

http://www.shga.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=3840
[TIL] About Tad Eareckson
Orion Price - 2013/03/11 15:12:28 UTC

Final bit of troll food, I read about Tad's reputation this morning.

Tad Eareckson is a generally discounted crackpot and internet troll. He doesn't fly and has been perma-banned from most everywhere: .org, oz report and all the local club websites with discussion forums like ours.

He has two main speaking points. 1. All HG landings should be done prone as belly landings using wheels. All other foot landings are suicidal, he will say. He schadenfreudes hard at our accidents and especially fatalities Image
Fuck you, OP. And you too, Bob - times ten.
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: landing

Post by Tad Eareckson »

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=31233
Aerodynamic Skids for Regular Streamlined Basebars
littlepilot - 2014/05/13 16:11:03 UTC

I was wondering if anyone could help me out with this. I was wondering, purely out of curiosity (not interested in buying now, already have nice wheels) if anyone knows where I might find the aerodynamic skids for regular flex wing streamlined basebars. I know that ATOS makes two kinds, both smooth and "tank-tracked." While these LOOK exactly the same as the ones I've seen on T2Cs and the like, they have a clamp which is designed for the ATOS rigid wing basebar.

My question is: Are people modifying these skids to fit regular streamlined basebars? Or are there skids designed for regular streamlined basebars somewhere else on the internet/the states? If so, does anyone have the link?

Thanks.
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=12682
Landing on your feet (for AEROTOW)- So Dangerous
Jack Axaopoulos - 2009/06/29 14:26:26 UTC

OMG!!! You dont even have wheels!!?!?!?!? Image
YOURE GONNA DIE FOR SUUUUREE!!!! Image
Image
I have a brilliant idea. People who cant land for sh*t.... LEARN TO LAND Image That way when a weak link breaks on you, ITS A NON-ISSUE. Genius huh??? Image
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: landing

Post by Tad Eareckson »

Jump to next post:
http://www.kitestrings.org/post6013.html#p6013

Field guide to the video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bAvvo0VKqg0


documenting most of the final ninety-one seconds of Paul Vernon's flying career and life as he knew it - all because the douchebags running hang gliding in general and Ridgely in particular were - and ARE - more interested in pretending to teach people HOW to do precision spot landings in fields of waist high wheat and narrow dry riverbeds with large rocks strewn all over the place than they are in teaching people how NOT to do precision spot landings in waist high wheat fields and narrow dry riverbeds with large rocks strewn all over the place.

Stills from the video...
- 800x800 full resolution crop from the center right side of the frame
- URL for the full resolution full frame
- 800x450 reduction of the full frame to display on the page

01-00016
- 01 - chronological order
- -0 - minutes
- 00 - seconds
- 16 - frame (30 fps)

From:
http://www.kitestrings.org/post3031.html#p3031
Tad Eareckson - 2012/10/07 20:23:46 UTC

Lined up pretty well with Davis's body - in front / to the upper right of him there's a brown field pattern that looks something like a turtle crawling away in the same direction. Its head is making a dent in the trees and it has a blue collar and a double hump (Bactrian Camel style) at the top of its shell.

Paul's a little white speck that starts out at the top of the forward hump and moves left / southwest / downwind across Oakland Road / MD 312 to over the wheat field and towards a pond inboard of the middle of Davis's port nose wire and located at:

39°00'16.34"N, 75°52'30.34"W
01-00016
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Over the second hump with the bottom of the treeline as a backdrop:

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Centered between the two largest buildings (in line with Davis's body):

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On downwind, emerged from wheat field, lined up with Davis, above pond:

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Dead center between the nose wires shortly before turning onto base:

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To the left and a little bit above the pond shortly before turning onto final:

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Directly above the back of Davis's helmet, on final:

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Over the green patch in the middle of the downwind end of the field:

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Halfway between the green patch and the nearest green intrusion from the road:

09-12803
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A few feet and frames shy of the intrusion and impact:

10-12926
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Stopped and gone from:
- view
- the sport and memory of most of the assholes in it
- a good quality of life

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Reminds me a lot of:

022-04610
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070-05111
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088-05301
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