I'm really anti gadget on this issue - for reasons that have been beaten to death over the decades...
- Extra procedures and disciplines are required which outweigh the procedures and disciplines required to launch safely hooked in.
- They're not bulletproof.
- Batteries die.
- Nag alarms get turned off.
- Warning lights can't be seen in bright sunlight.
- The disruption that's most likely to put you at launch with a dangling carabiner is the same one that's gonna neutralize the effectiveness of your gadget.
- They're invariably used as further excuses to skip hook-in checks and kill the message.
Took a quick look at some the gadgets that kidsandcars are pushing and, gotta admit, some of them are pretty impressive - CAREseat in particular. Pretty bulletproof, minimal hassle, redundancy, no real downsides per se.
But probably a little pricey, not currently commercially available, dependent upon some of the intelligence only existing in modern cars.
My thoughts are that unless something like this were made mandatory - and that day may come but don't hold your breath - the kind of person who'd be most likely to install one of these things would be the kind of person least likely to need it. Also that as well thought out, designed, engineered, manufactured as one of these things may be it MUST NOT be allowed to become an excuse to not "look before you lock".
It's amazing that as widespread and mainstream as this issue is (44 dead US kids last year, 17 so far this) and as many people as there are doing work - much of it good - on solutions that nobody's really nailed the message: ASSUME the kid's in the car every time you're about to slam the door shut.
You are NEVER hooked in.
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Tad Eareckson
- Posts: 9161
- Joined: 2010/11/25 03:48:55 UTC
Re: You are NEVER hooked in.
http://www.rmhpa.org/messageboard/viewtopic.php?t=3029
HOOK IN
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=13359
Today was a bad day!
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...those are the only places in which it actually works.
If you rub a little peanut butter on your ankles in the morning that'll SEEM to work really well for protection against rattlesnake bite. It won't actually DO anything - but all you fuckin' morons with brains the sizes of walnuts will be feeling bulletproof by the time you've gotten half your battens stuffed. And you'll start making rubbing peanut butter on your ankles mandatory for all your local sites - spring, summer, fall, and winter. (Works best in the winter.)
2. Who's made hang checks mandatory parts of your routines? What's your punishment for people who don't do hang checks? You see somebody about to launch unhooked you only stop him if you saw him doing a hang check five or ten minutes prior?
3. I don't know when the last time you read the fuckin' SOPs was - or even if they're anywhere in the ballpark of your comprehension level - but here's what's MANDATORY:
...obviously.
2. Why does the fuckin' strap need to be straight and happy? How badly would Kunio have been killed if his strap had been twisted, knotted, and frayed halfway through?
HOOK IN
This still gets lotsa people - thanks entirely to stupid pigfuckers like the ones that totally infest your vile little club.BJ Herring - 2010/05/01 19:15
This still gets me.
It's EXTREMELY popular an the internet forums...The Aussie method is very popular on the internet forums where they hook the harness to the hang glider as part of the pre-flight and never unhook it.
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=13359
Today was a bad day!
...because...Mike Bomstad - 2009/08/26 04:21:15 UTC
The harness is part of the aircraft... end of story.
(Just because it's easy to remove, does not mean it should be. Dont choose the path of least resistance)
Attach it to the wing, completing the aircraft.... then preflight the completed aircraft.
Buckle yourself into the cockpit and then your ready.
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...those are the only places in which it actually works.
1. You fuckin' douchebags would SEEM to do well by only using white webbing for backup loops 'cause unhooked launches tend to be once in every five hundred cycles events. ANYTHING you decide to do or not do will SEEM to work well.Here, we seem to do well by making a hang-check as a mandatory part of the routine.
If you rub a little peanut butter on your ankles in the morning that'll SEEM to work really well for protection against rattlesnake bite. It won't actually DO anything - but all you fuckin' morons with brains the sizes of walnuts will be feeling bulletproof by the time you've gotten half your battens stuffed. And you'll start making rubbing peanut butter on your ankles mandatory for all your local sites - spring, summer, fall, and winter. (Works best in the winter.)
2. Who's made hang checks mandatory parts of your routines? What's your punishment for people who don't do hang checks? You see somebody about to launch unhooked you only stop him if you saw him doing a hang check five or ten minutes prior?
3. I don't know when the last time you read the fuckin' SOPs was - or even if they're anywhere in the ballpark of your comprehension level - but here's what's MANDATORY:
But none of you pieces of shit will DO IT - 'cause Tom Galvin has warned you all that complying with USHGA regulations will give you a false sense of security.With each flight, demonstrates a method of establishing that the pilot is hooked in just prior to launch.
Try a little peanut butter on your forehead just before you put your helmet on. It's been working perfectly for snakebite so far, right? I one hundred percent guarantee you it'll seem to work perfectly for preventing unhooked launches for a long time as well. And if it misses once and you survive, just try using more peanut butter.Whatever it is, we just want to do it every single time.
This is my reminder (publicly) to focus...
GOOD. I *SO* hope to read a report of one of you motherfuckers getting splattered all over the base of Lookout. That'll help....on the basic pre-flight and a solid hang-check every time I fly.
It's dead. That's Kunio...
...obviously.
1. That's not a HANG check. You're not HANGING. That's a WALK-THROUGH.PS. When I say hang check, even if it's just a self guided step forward to look back and inspect the hang strap being straight and happy.
2. Why does the fuckin' strap need to be straight and happy? How badly would Kunio have been killed if his strap had been twisted, knotted, and frayed halfway through?
Nah. Keep doing your mandatory hang checks in the setup area. Please don't EVER stop flying - or START adhering to USHGA's hook-in check requirement.If that ever gets to be something that falls by the way-side when it's uber soarable, or when I'm gabbing to someone... I've told myself I'll stop flying.
Right. What happened to Kunio in front of his wife and little girls won't really work for you. But the thought of the horror of a self imposed lifetime grounding... Now THAT'S something that'll really get you FOCUSED on doing things right.And that's a motivator to do it right.
Anything but the right thing - asshole.Whatever we have to do.
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Tad Eareckson
- Posts: 9161
- Joined: 2010/11/25 03:48:55 UTC
Re: You are NEVER hooked in.
http://www.rmhpa.org/messageboard/viewtopic.php?t=3029
HOOK IN
Failure to hook in 6/29/12
So how many ratings have you signed off on people doing hook-in checks consistently? Can you refer us to any of their videos so's we can watch what they're doing on launch. How come none of them lifted any more of a finger to back me than you did?
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...you REFUSE to do it.
- How far the nose is pointed up.
Carabineer
- What we use to hook ourselves in.
Hang check
- What we use to make sure we're hooked in.
Just prior
- Fifteen to thirty minutes. Or whatever. Whichever figure is larger.
Backup loop
- What we use to stay attached to the glider after our main breaks.
Spreader
- What we use to keep our carabineers from being crushed by the compression of the suspension webbing.
Downtubes
- Where we put our hands to get the extra control we need for landing.
LZ
- A narrow dry riverbed with large rocks strewn all over the place.
Wheels
- What girls and faggots who haven't perfected their flare timing sometimes need to keep from being injured on landing.
Spiral fracture of the humerus
- Most common hang gliding injury.
Three point bridal
- Splits the tow pressure between the pilot and glider.
Release
- What we always have within easy reach.
Weak link
- What we use to prevent lockouts, get off tow in emergencies, generally increase the safety of the towing operation.
Hook knife
- What we use to cut ourselves off tow when our releases and weak links don't work.
Inconvenience
- Any thing that happens after a weak link break.
Bobby Bailey
- Fucking genius when it comes to this shit.
Twisted agenda
- Any attempt to lower the hang gliding fatality rate below the standard of one participant per thousand per year.
Wuffo
- Anyone interested in hang gliding. Frequently used as a scapegoat to cover for the incompetence of competent pilots.
HOOK IN
It wasn't at Henson or DURING the Team Challenge. It was at Whitwell and it was the first (and last) wind dummy flight before what was supposed to have been the first round of the first day.Allen Sparks - 2010/05/05 05:19
Another tragedy is the story of Bill Priday who launched unhooked at Hensons Gap during the Team Challenge.
TWO weeks before at the McConnellsburg fly-in - right after he'd been intercepted at the back of the south ramp with his carabiner dangling.I had met him just a week before and we had a great jam session around the camp fire.
Those Rocky Mountain assholes? Not entirely sure how I'd react to that.These sad events are a stark reminder to me of how lucky I am to be here with the living.
Doesn't sound like you were assisted all that well.In 1976 I launched unhooked on a windy assisted cliff launch...
And in 1981 USHGA instituted a hook-in check requirement regulation which you and everybody else chose to totally ignore. And for over a dozen years after that Doug Hildreth was pleading for people to adhere to it. And you ignored him too. And maybe if you'd had a long talk about hook-in checks with Bill instead of a jam session he'd have been able to continue flying gliders and having jam sessions around campfires beyond the two weeks he had left as things were. That's what I'd have done anyway. But I'm a really crappy guitar player....and miraculously survived unscathed.
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=26557I would not expect to survive another such event.
Failure to hook in 6/29/12
But you'll happily stand around doing NOTHING when I'm engaging your pieces o' shit Colorado buddies on this issue and Tom Galvin is sabotaging my efforts and the scum controlling that wire is banning me and deleting all of my posts. Big help.Allen Sparks - 2012/07/13 12:41:24 UTC
As a USHPA observer, I will not sign off for a USHPA rating until the pilot has demonstrated that he is doing a hook-in check consistently, just prior to launch, on every flight I observe.
So how many ratings have you signed off on people doing hook-in checks consistently? Can you refer us to any of their videos so's we can watch what they're doing on launch. How come none of them lifted any more of a finger to back me than you did?
You're not a good man, Allen. Good men don't do that much nothing when that much evil is going on. You have a lot of things to make up for in your and our history and you're not really doing shit.The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.
You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life. - Winston Churchill
Tim Meehan - 2010/05/05 14:05
Arvada
I wonder if we can get JY to share his "Lookout-Unhooked, Unplugged, and Unhinged, robo-RC HG" story on MTV.
I was there. Saw the whole thing. Luckily no one hurt and it was a beautiful sight. JY has to tell it though.
Setting the stage: "It was a perfect Lookout glass-off evening. Back in the day. Back when they happened every single night and the year-round temperature never varied above 79-degrees or below 58..."
Pick it up from there, JY...
Thank you. Tells me everything I need to know.John Wilber - 2010/05/05 18:36
Littleton
1988. I launched from Fort Funston with no leg loops...
I'll hafta take your word for it. I wouldn't know.That will give you a little surge of adrenalin.
Sounds like you opted for hanging from the downtubes. Gotta love the consistency.Once I got proned out and manged not to land (crash) in the ocean, and quit shaking, I flew around for a while trying to figure out how to land while hanging from the down tubes, or staying mostly prone. Broke a down tube.
'Cause you're a total fuckin' moron. 'Cause even in strong glassy coastal air where all you hafta do is allow the glider to float up to verify your connection and leg loops...Why did this happen?
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...you REFUSE to do it.
Bullshit. See above about you being a total fucking moron. Ditto for anyone and everyone you know who's on speaking terms with you.A really pretty woffo was asking questions, and I was showing off.
Congratulations on your rating.John Wilber - 42029 - H4 - 1988/09/12 - Bob Faris - AT FL FSL RLF TUR XC
We went way south of stupid eons ago, Jim.Jim Yocom - 2010/05/05 21:55
Golden
Stupid
We've been hearing it since the Seventies.Most have already heard it, but for the benefit of newbies...
Wuffo. As in "What for?" See if you can figure out how to fuck up the spelling and pronunciation a little more.I was ready to fly, but amazingly the conditions kept changing - so unusual for Lookout. A couple times I walked to launch, only to wait and then go back to the set up area. Finally a woofo...
I so do hope he was able to get to someone who knew what the fuck he was talking about later....hiked up to launch and started asking me question after question.
Angle of AttackI moved my glider to launch and the questions continued.
- How far the nose is pointed up.
Carabineer
- What we use to hook ourselves in.
Hang check
- What we use to make sure we're hooked in.
Just prior
- Fifteen to thirty minutes. Or whatever. Whichever figure is larger.
Backup loop
- What we use to stay attached to the glider after our main breaks.
Spreader
- What we use to keep our carabineers from being crushed by the compression of the suspension webbing.
Downtubes
- Where we put our hands to get the extra control we need for landing.
LZ
- A narrow dry riverbed with large rocks strewn all over the place.
Wheels
- What girls and faggots who haven't perfected their flare timing sometimes need to keep from being injured on landing.
Spiral fracture of the humerus
- Most common hang gliding injury.
Three point bridal
- Splits the tow pressure between the pilot and glider.
Release
- What we always have within easy reach.
Weak link
- What we use to prevent lockouts, get off tow in emergencies, generally increase the safety of the towing operation.
Hook knife
- What we use to cut ourselves off tow when our releases and weak links don't work.
Inconvenience
- Any thing that happens after a weak link break.
Bobby Bailey
- Fucking genius when it comes to this shit.
Twisted agenda
- Any attempt to lower the hang gliding fatality rate below the standard of one participant per thousand per year.
Wuffo
- Anyone interested in hang gliding. Frequently used as a scapegoat to cover for the incompetence of competent pilots.
Extraordinarily free.Finally, just as he ran out of questions and was walking away, a nice cycle came through launch. At last I was to escape the drone of questioning and be free in the air.
People who DO have fuckin' clues what they're doing and DON'T have total shit for brains lift the glider up BEFORE starting nice walks, jogs, and runs.I did a nice walk, jog, run and the glider began flying, rising up as my hands slid down the control frame. I pulled down on the frame, but at the same time thought this is not right, the glider was not lifting me - I must be unhooked.
Not interested. Don't give flying fucks what total douchebags who can't be bothered to follow rules, do hook-in checks do after the launch unhooked or what happens to them.I immediately shoved the glider forward into the air...
Too bad you didn't hold on long enough to get far enough away from the slope to kill yourself....which put me square on my rear 1/2 way down launch.
You should've had your rating revoked. Ditto for the asshole who signed you off.I sat watching my Wills Wing Ram Air fly away from the hill and make a gentle turn to the left. I was relieved it turned away from the houses below where it might hit someone. The glider continued to turn, making 2 complete 360s, gaining about 50ft. Once over launch, it straightened out disappearing over the back. Several PG pilots and I ran back to find the glider upright in a bush with nary a scratch. MR. joked it was the best flight that glider ever made. Probably true - I never flew that Ram Air very well!
Oh good. Yet another shitheaded unhooked launcher is gonna tell his fellow shitheads the best way to prevent unhooked launches.Moral of the story is to have a launch procedure/checklist that you complete every time.
Focus on the really important stuff. Make sure all of your safety rings are in place. So many needless deaths we could prevent if only people would be more conscientious about that.If you are interrupted, start over.
And that procedure must NEVER include the one addressing this particular issue and included in the One through Four rating requirements.Just like setting up and preflighting, you need a procedure that you never vary.
Of course you didn't. We've already established that you've got total shit for brains. Hopefully your wuffo realized that and flushed everything you told him about hang gliding out of his system.I never thought it would happen to me...
OF COURSE IT COULD! It happened to BOTH you and Jim Keen-Intellect Rooney! What chance could any of us muppet hook-in checkers possibly have?...but it did, so it could happen to you.
And I'm so extraordinarily happy to see you continuing with the precise same game plan and expecting different results. Gives me a tiny bit of hope for the gene pool.I am happy to report it has not happened again and I intend to keep it that way.
On 2014/02/11 Jon Orders got a felony criminal negligence conviction and was sentenced to five months in jail for making the same mistake. Glad you Colorado dickheads were able to have so much fun with this one.Tim Meehan - 2010/05/05 23:59
And at the annual holiday banquet that year, JY was awarded a really cool and gigantically oversized RC controller. Looked like a giant boom box with joysticks and an antenna.
Thems was the days...
Because, of course, rules don't apply to you individually.For myself...
Oh! And after you've checked YOUR connection you're done, good to go. Just hook your passenger in whenever the fuck you feel like it, don't check, assume HER connection is fine, run off the mountain whenever....I always take a moment just before I connect the passenger to take one-more-look at the gear. Make sure everything is still connected and connected properly. Take a deep breath. Focus. Check every attachment point one_more_time.
No mention of HER headstone, of course. And statistically when someone dies in an unhooked tandem incident it's the passenger. VERY telling. Fuckin' sociopath.Last thing I want are the words "wasn't paying attention," engraved on my headstone. Posthumous reputation is a preventative motivating factor.
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Tad Eareckson
- Posts: 9161
- Joined: 2010/11/25 03:48:55 UTC
Re: You are NEVER hooked in.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RoGv_5uGdNo
7-6-12 Mansfield encampment (a day in the life) 77 mile
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=13359
Today was a bad day!
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He looked stupid when the camera started rolling. Hard for anybody as off the scale stupid as Mike is not to.
Rigid wing glider, harness, helmet, parachute, instrument deck, platform launch rig, wing supports, retrieval chute. State of the art, high performance, high tech, beautifully engineered and constructed.
Chintzy dollar and a half two-string "release" "system" with the lanyard within easy reach. Total shit capacity but it's probably adequate to his surface tow equivalent of the Rooney Link he's undoubtedly using as a pitch and lockout protector.
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The vast majority of unhooked launches result in nothing more than bruising, glider damage, and embarrassment. Statistically you're WAY better off launching unhooked than you are separating from your glider when the flight's underway. You should NEVER prone out under a glider - whether it's for a totally stupid hang check or a totally nonstupid platform or dolly launch - until you've seen your carabiner close and/or heard it click. Even if the consequences can be no worse than looking stupid you don't go down until you've made that check. It's a helluva lot easier and more effective to preflight that connection while you're standing up and turned around than it is while you're hanging and trying to roll, turn your head, and look back up to where you were a few seconds ago.
And what's the point of doing a hang check prior to the launch sequence on a platform or dolly launch? You WILL be doing a hang check before things start moving. What's the use of cluttering the preflight checks and activities with a totally useless copy of something that's gonna happen anyway whether you want it to or not?
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You are one year, one month, and eighteen days away from coming within one very lucky break of going off HERE:
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with your carabiner dangling.
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COMPLETE DISBELIEF! How could something like this POSSIBLY happen? To me? Again? Twice in a period of under fourteen months? I mean, I keep doing the same thing over and over... Surely I should be getting better results.
People from the extremes of the popularity range, from T** at K*** S****** on up to Rob Friend-Of-Every-Pilot-He-Meets Kells have been saying this for decades - ever since the moronic Aussie Method first reared its ugly head: Conditioning yourself to think that any time you're in a harness and under a glider there's no chance that you're not safely connected to it...
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18695
How could this accident happen?
Keep up the great work, Mike. So far it's just been a bit o' inconvenience but with just a little more effort and luck you could become to the Aussie Method what Zack Marzec became to the standard aerotow weak link.
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No Mike, not in the context of THIS:Mike Bomstad - 2012/07/19
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RoGv_5uGdNo
Little pre flight footage on the rig. Doesn't get much better!
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=13359
Today was a bad day!
crap anyway.Mike Bomstad - 2009/08/26 04:21:15 UTC
The harness is part of the aircraft... end of story.
(Just because it's easy to remove, does not mean it should be. Dont choose the path of least resistance)
Attach it to the wing, completing the aircraft.... then preflight the completed aircraft.
Buckle yourself into the cockpit and then your ready.
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17-00908Oh, I guess we should hook you in. Unless you just wanna lay down and look stupid for the camera.
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He looked stupid when the camera started rolling. Hard for anybody as off the scale stupid as Mike is not to.
Rigid wing glider, harness, helmet, parachute, instrument deck, platform launch rig, wing supports, retrieval chute. State of the art, high performance, high tech, beautifully engineered and constructed.
Chintzy dollar and a half two-string "release" "system" with the lanyard within easy reach. Total shit capacity but it's probably adequate to his surface tow equivalent of the Rooney Link he's undoubtedly using as a pitch and lockout protector.
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Good thing you got that backup and have the carabiner locked - speaking of stupidity.OK. Hooked up. Main and backup. Carabiner locked.
He's already buckled into the "cockpit" and he hasn't completed the aircraft OR preflighted the most critical connection of the assembly. He's assuming he's hooked in and that the connection doesn't look like THIS:Attach it to the wing, completing the aircraft.... then preflight the completed aircraft.
Buckle yourself into the cockpit and then your ready.
The vast majority of unhooked launches result in nothing more than bruising, glider damage, and embarrassment. Statistically you're WAY better off launching unhooked than you are separating from your glider when the flight's underway. You should NEVER prone out under a glider - whether it's for a totally stupid hang check or a totally nonstupid platform or dolly launch - until you've seen your carabiner close and/or heard it click. Even if the consequences can be no worse than looking stupid you don't go down until you've made that check. It's a helluva lot easier and more effective to preflight that connection while you're standing up and turned around than it is while you're hanging and trying to roll, turn your head, and look back up to where you were a few seconds ago.
And what's the point of doing a hang check prior to the launch sequence on a platform or dolly launch? You WILL be doing a hang check before things start moving. What's the use of cluttering the preflight checks and activities with a totally useless copy of something that's gonna happen anyway whether you want it to or not?
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62-31805
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You are one year, one month, and eighteen days away from coming within one very lucky break of going off HERE:
39-B14607
http://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8126/28852425302_d70604f440_o.png
with your carabiner dangling.
11-A12819
http://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8339/28924980016_2ba1d20ef7_o.png
http://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8253/28924975726_0d24a615c2_o.png
13-A14319
COMPLETE DISBELIEF! How could something like this POSSIBLY happen? To me? Again? Twice in a period of under fourteen months? I mean, I keep doing the same thing over and over... Surely I should be getting better results.
People from the extremes of the popularity range, from T** at K*** S****** on up to Rob Friend-Of-Every-Pilot-He-Meets Kells have been saying this for decades - ever since the moronic Aussie Method first reared its ugly head: Conditioning yourself to think that any time you're in a harness and under a glider there's no chance that you're not safely connected to it...
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18695
How could this accident happen?
...is a monumentally bad idea.William Olive - 2010/01/28 04:50:53 UTC
Phil Beck did this twice (or was that three times?) in a day at Hexham (Victoria) one time while foot launch aerotow testing gliders. Of course, with a swag of gliders to test fly, Phil would unclip from the glider he'd just landed, then clip into the next one to be tested.
Except, at least twice, he didn't clip in.
Keep up the great work, Mike. So far it's just been a bit o' inconvenience but with just a little more effort and luck you could become to the Aussie Method what Zack Marzec became to the standard aerotow weak link.
-
Tad Eareckson
- Posts: 9161
- Joined: 2010/11/25 03:48:55 UTC
Re: You are NEVER hooked in.
Hey potential baby roasters (anybody and everybody who has a baby, ever transports him in something resembling a car, lives south of Point Barrow and north of Elephant Island)...
I didn't express things very well with THIS:
If your procedure is to:
http://www.kidsandcars.org/userfiles/store/look-before-you-lock-en-sp.pdf
If, however, your procedure is:
Forget the fact that your baby's alive, well, safe, and happy at day care at noon. If you weren't scared shitless you were gonna roast your baby AND/OR failed to check the back BEFORE slamming your door, for the purpose of the exercise you roasted your baby. And the only responsible thing to do at that point is have him adopted by people WITH functional brains that evening.
And I one hundred percent guarantee you that there are untold hundreds of parents and exparents who would sell their souls in a heartbeat to be able to go back in time and do exactly that.
The lift and tuggers and reasonable facsimiles are one hundred percent effective because they're ALWAYS scared shitless they're about to fuck up AND...
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=13359
Today was a bad day!
13-03110
http://c2.staticflickr.com/4/3697/13700915564_87a2a336b0_o.png
http://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2912/13700562685_86575e9220_o.png
14-03129
...to verify that they're not.
These Kids And Cars idiots are throwing out all kinds of crap that anyone with a functional brain KNOWS *WILL* FAIL a huge percentage of the time. And ONE check failure is WAY too many.
This total fucking moron:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7387/10125512503_2fc2445a42_o.png
is in the process of watching the catastrophic failure of a critical check he's been using his entire career to keep his stupid ass alive. Red lights should be flashing and alarm bells should be deafening. But... big fuckin' deal. He's as totally unfazed by what's happening as he has been by hundreds of warnings from people with functional brains that this is an extremely dangerous and counterproductive strategy and the incident reports...
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18695
How could this accident happen?
11-A12819
http://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8339/28924980016_2ba1d20ef7_o.png
WTF!!! Two plus two can sometimes equal FOUR? SHIT!!!!!!!
13-A14319
http://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8253/28924975726_0d24a615c2_o.png
Complete disbelief! Everybody knows it really equals SIX! Oh well, I'll just run the equation next weekend and I'm sure I'll be getting six again. The chances I'll get four again are pretty microscopic - if you look at the track record I've racked up.
Use a mindset, strategy, procedure that results in four 100.0000 percent of the time - FOR THE *CHECK*. Anything under that you need to go back and REALLY check your arithmetic. And don't be the LEAST bit reassured by your perfect track record of not ever having roasted a baby.
I didn't express things very well with THIS:
Forget the fact that lift and tuggers and reasonable facsimiles are the only classes of foot launchers who never launch unhooked. Not launching unhooked shouldn't really be the goal here. The REAL goal is to NEVER miss or fuck up the final two seconds procedure you've adopted to guard against launching unhooked. Not launching unhooked is just a side effect of how effectively you implement your procedure.Tad Eareckson - 2014/07/24 14:15:53 UTC
I can't say that the lift and tug procedure of which I'm the primary proponent prevents unhooked launches. But that's only 'cause people who practice lift and tug are scared shitless of launching unhooked at the only time it counts. And I CAN say lift and tuggers and reasonable facsimiles are the only classes of foot launchers who never launch unhooked. ALL others use bullshit checklists, procedures, routines, "BE SAFE" equivalents and drop like freakin' flies.
If your procedure is to:
http://www.kidsandcars.org/userfiles/store/look-before-you-lock-en-sp.pdf
then fuck you and your kid. You're both blights on the gene pool and the planet can't survive your presence on it....open the back door of your car every time you park to check that no one has been left behind.
If, however, your procedure is:
then stay tuned.LOOK BEFORE YOU LOCK
Forget the fact that your baby's alive, well, safe, and happy at day care at noon. If you weren't scared shitless you were gonna roast your baby AND/OR failed to check the back BEFORE slamming your door, for the purpose of the exercise you roasted your baby. And the only responsible thing to do at that point is have him adopted by people WITH functional brains that evening.
And I one hundred percent guarantee you that there are untold hundreds of parents and exparents who would sell their souls in a heartbeat to be able to go back in time and do exactly that.
The lift and tuggers and reasonable facsimiles are one hundred percent effective because they're ALWAYS scared shitless they're about to fuck up AND...
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=13359
Today was a bad day!
...they choose and follow the path of least resistance:Mike Bomstad - 2009/08/26 04:21:15 UTC
The harness is part of the aircraft... end of story.
(Just because it's easy to remove, does not mean it should be. Dont choose the path of least resistance)
13-03110
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14-03129
...to verify that they're not.
These Kids And Cars idiots are throwing out all kinds of crap that anyone with a functional brain KNOWS *WILL* FAIL a huge percentage of the time. And ONE check failure is WAY too many.
This total fucking moron:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7387/10125512503_2fc2445a42_o.png
is in the process of watching the catastrophic failure of a critical check he's been using his entire career to keep his stupid ass alive. Red lights should be flashing and alarm bells should be deafening. But... big fuckin' deal. He's as totally unfazed by what's happening as he has been by hundreds of warnings from people with functional brains that this is an extremely dangerous and counterproductive strategy and the incident reports...
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18695
How could this accident happen?
...vividly illustrating EXACTLY what they're saying.William Olive - 2010/01/28 04:50:53 UTC
Phil Beck did this twice (or was that three times?) in a day at Hexham (Victoria) one time while foot launch aerotow testing gliders. Of course, with a swag of gliders to test fly, Phil would unclip from the glider he'd just landed, then clip into the next one to be tested.
Except, at least twice, he didn't clip in.
11-A12819
http://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8339/28924980016_2ba1d20ef7_o.png
WTF!!! Two plus two can sometimes equal FOUR? SHIT!!!!!!!
13-A14319
http://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8253/28924975726_0d24a615c2_o.png
Complete disbelief! Everybody knows it really equals SIX! Oh well, I'll just run the equation next weekend and I'm sure I'll be getting six again. The chances I'll get four again are pretty microscopic - if you look at the track record I've racked up.
Use a mindset, strategy, procedure that results in four 100.0000 percent of the time - FOR THE *CHECK*. Anything under that you need to go back and REALLY check your arithmetic. And don't be the LEAST bit reassured by your perfect track record of not ever having roasted a baby.
-
Tad Eareckson
- Posts: 9161
- Joined: 2010/11/25 03:48:55 UTC
Re: You are NEVER hooked in.
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=13359
Today was a bad day!
- hesitate to even post
- post ONLY under the PREMISE of FWIW
I've got a hundred times the respect for Robert Seckold that I do for you 'cause - even though he was a low double digit IQ Aussie Methodist incapable of grasping the concept of a hook-in check or recognizing any possible value in ever doing one - he was at least genuinely concerned about the issue of people launching unhooked and passionate about what he genuinely believed was the solution.
I know I'm human and pretty much guaranteed to launch unhooked if I ever start believing either that I'm unlikely to launch unhooked or willing to accept a one in a billion chance of launching unhooked as an inevitable cost of doing business. So I'm ALWAYS scared shitless I'm about to do it on EVERY foot launch. And that fear NEVER diminishes. And thus there's ZERO chance that I - or anyone else who has or adopts that strategy - will do it.
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14-03129
Fuckin' asshole.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tj1Z_BI5OXs
This is your job, you do it all the time, and 99.9 percent of your flying is with extremely familiar equipment at the same handful of sites after the same daily preps that are so routine you could do them sleepwalking. So how 'bout REAL world people who do this recreationally a couple dozen times a year, go on road trips to fly-ins and comps, move up the equipment ladder at pretty fast paces, have to figure out how to make new gadgets work, help friends with similar issues, deal shuttling and retrieval issues, herd and feed dogs and kids?
And make sure you don't look around and see what's going on with a very solid percentage of your buddies doing the same kind of flying you do at similar frequencies who've adopted the same kinda stupid bullshit mindsets, strategies, procedures that this total douchebag is selling.
And also make sure you don't look at any of the disaster case studies in which the distraction or brain lapse that takes out the action of hooking in is what also takes out the preflight check you're using to confirm that you're hooked in.
And watch Ryan Voight here pulling loops:
http://vimeo.com/26210217
Smooth, flawless, beautiful! Zilch chance that he's ever gonna blow the glider or tumble. Therefore, obviously, YOU TOO will have zilch chances of blowing a loop and blowing the glider or tumbling!
Me, Rob? I'm COUNTING ON being standing at the edge of the ramp with my carabiner dangling two seconds before my next launch attempt. I really can't imagine any other scenario. If I could I'd be scared much less shitless as I am as things are. And the absolute scariest thing I can think of is standing at the edge of a ramp two seconds before a launch attempt not being scared shitless that my carabiner was dangling.
http://thetension.blogspot.com/2007_07_15_archive.html
...sometimes the first, second, or fourth. Anything to relieve the mind numbing monotony of always trying to execute procedures and tasks the same tedious way.
And when I've committed to launch sometimes I level the wings, hold the nose down, wait for a good straight in puff, thrust off hard... Sometimes I try other stuff.
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3873/14559992972_97b1a2a525_o.png
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3900/14557433291_0d22597fd6_o.png
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...bring it alive!
...peak proficiency.
http://www.newscientist.com/articleimages/dn8186/0-falcon-divebombing-starlings-wins-top-photo-prize.html
http://www.newscientist.com/data/images/ns/cms/dn8186/dn8186-1_700.jpg[/img]
2. So Jon Orders has probably just finished up five months in jail for dropping an unhooked passenger a thousand feet. He was trained and certified under a protocol that allowed for ZILCH variety or facsimiles of true thinking. So where were your letters to Jon, his lawyer, the court, the press, PAC explaining how he'd been set up for inevitable failure? How 'bout your article in the magazine?
3. Lemme tell ya sumpin', asshole...
NEVER in the entire history of hang gliding has there been a long term instructor capable of TRUE THINKING. If there had been there'd have never been such things as:
- backup loops
- locking carabiners
- floating crossbars
- foot landing requirements
- traffic cones
- spiral fractures of the humerus
- narrow dry riverbed with large rocks strewn all over the place landing options
- tandem training
- sidewire failures
- center of mass tow bridles
- pro tow bridles
- releases within easy reach
- backup releases
- Linknives
- Birrenators
- 130 pound test pitch and lockout preventers
- Ryan Rooney instant hands free releases
- tow mast breakaway protectors
- the Cone of Safety
- the Aussie Method
- "Hook In!" plaques
- unhooked launches
- forum moderators
- Davis Straub
- opinions
4. So you've been doing all this "true thinking", right?
http://www.chgpa.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=6342
The view from the other end of the rope
5. How 'bout giving us some other examples of the benefits "true thinking" in this game we play? If "true thinking" is such an important edge in hang gliding how come there's not a four month old pinheaded Turkey Vulture on the planet that can't kick our asses in anything and everything we do blindfolded with a third of its primaries snipped off?
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24846
Is this a joke ?
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=25015
Zippy pounds in
09-05019
http://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2928/13891086719_3ba7e65d38_o.png
you wanna make goddam sure you don't do THIS:
2-112
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so you do THIS:
14-03129
http://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2912/13700562685_86575e9220_o.png
That's reactive thinking at its finest. You wanna do any facsimiles of TRUE thinking above and beyond that you be my guest. I totally encourage you to. One more dickheaded instructor I won't hafta deal with anymore and can honor with a Darwin Award and use as a cautionary tale.
There's one best place for that Peregrine to be to connect with a Starling. And there's one best place for the most vulnerable Starlings to be in order to minimize the chances of being connected with. And every goddam last one of them is doing his utmost to get there.
http://ceredigionbirds33.blogspot.com/2012_03_01_archive.html
That's also reactive thinking at its finest and exactly how things work on dogfights and XC comps. "True thinking" is a great place for the drawing board - which, by the way, is where you don't do any. It has ZERO place between the setup and breakdown areas and I DEFY you to cite a sane example.
Today was a bad day!
If I too had a brain the size of a walnut I TOO would be very hesitant to "EVEN" post.Rob McKenzie - 2009/08/26 17:26:12 UTC
I hesitate to even post.
Then fuck you and the horse you rode in on. We're talking about a serious life and death issue that's resulted in an immeasurable amount of pain and suffering for direct victims - pilots and passengers - and friends and families. And the unhooked launch death of Lenami Godinez-Avila thirty-two months and two days following your despicable post will be the single event that will bring over a hundred times more global attention to the sport of hang gliding than whatever the hell the runner up has scored.I have no intention to sway anyone to do what I do...
We already know it's worth shit - as are you. NOBODY who gives a flying fuck about the sport and its participants comes into a discussion with bullshit like:...but will post only under the premise of FWIW.
- hesitate to even post
- post ONLY under the PREMISE of FWIW
I've got a hundred times the respect for Robert Seckold that I do for you 'cause - even though he was a low double digit IQ Aussie Methodist incapable of grasping the concept of a hook-in check or recognizing any possible value in ever doing one - he was at least genuinely concerned about the issue of people launching unhooked and passionate about what he genuinely believed was the solution.
And a dice roller. Fuck you.I believe that if I fly long enough, numbers lead to an eventual failure to hook in. I'm human.
I know I'm human and pretty much guaranteed to launch unhooked if I ever start believing either that I'm unlikely to launch unhooked or willing to accept a one in a billion chance of launching unhooked as an inevitable cost of doing business. So I'm ALWAYS scared shitless I'm about to do it on EVERY foot launch. And that fear NEVER diminishes. And thus there's ZERO chance that I - or anyone else who has or adopts that strategy - will do it.
Yeah, so did Kunio. He left the sport with an absolutely outstanding track record.I do a hang check before nearly every flight.
Good thing. Hard to imagine that anyone with any shred of decency would feel like helping you out with ANYTHING.I do it without needing a nose or keel assist as I balance my weight over the basetube.
13-03110I'm more likely to do a hang check if I don't need to trouble others for help.
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14-03129
Fuckin' asshole.
And here's what Mike Barber has to say about one in a thousand odds:I probably miss the hang check about 1 in 1000 flights.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tj1Z_BI5OXs
Mike Barber - 2007/12/25
I don't risk safety any more. I'd say... the absolute hardest I would push it is on a thousand to one chance of getting hurt - and that's pushing VERY hard. It's pushing it TOO hard. Because, I do this more than a thousand times a year. You're really pushing the envelope at a thousand to one chance of getting hurt. It should be more like one in a HUNDRED thousand - which is probably the same as driving your car.
So does Eric Hinrichs - with a thousandth of the effort and time commitment that you do with your idiot unassisted hang check bullshit.I feel leg loops...
Who the fuck cares? What does any of that bullshit have anything to do with anything worth talking about?...and look for height above basetube and twisting in lines during the hang check.
For YOU - who's the only person you give a rat's ass about.I have twice in the last 10,000 or so flights actually laid on the ground unhooked while doing my self hang check. So numbers indicate about 1 in 5000 chance of forgetting to hook in.
This is your job, you do it all the time, and 99.9 percent of your flying is with extremely familiar equipment at the same handful of sites after the same daily preps that are so routine you could do them sleepwalking. So how 'bout REAL world people who do this recreationally a couple dozen times a year, go on road trips to fly-ins and comps, move up the equipment ladder at pretty fast paces, have to figure out how to make new gadgets work, help friends with similar issues, deal shuttling and retrieval issues, herd and feed dogs and kids?
That's not MUCH hope but I'll take what I can get.Multiply rate of failure to hook in by failure to hang check and I have perhaps a 1 in 5 million chance of launching unhooked.
...an average of 1.37 flights per day...With 500 flights a year...
Hear that - all you other people who average 1.37 flights a day in environments and routines similar to Rob's? You've got virtually NOTHING to worry about! Once every five thousand years you're gonna get your head taken off by a meteorite so this is essentially a nonissue. So let's forget about it and get back to perfecting your flare timing....I have therefore about 1 failed hookin launch every 50,000 years.
And make sure you don't look around and see what's going on with a very solid percentage of your buddies doing the same kind of flying you do at similar frequencies who've adopted the same kinda stupid bullshit mindsets, strategies, procedures that this total douchebag is selling.
And also make sure you don't look at any of the disaster case studies in which the distraction or brain lapse that takes out the action of hooking in is what also takes out the preflight check you're using to confirm that you're hooked in.
And watch Ryan Voight here pulling loops:
http://vimeo.com/26210217
Smooth, flawless, beautiful! Zilch chance that he's ever gonna blow the glider or tumble. Therefore, obviously, YOU TOO will have zilch chances of blowing a loop and blowing the glider or tumbling!
But, again, statistically you'll have had your head taken off by a meteorite about five hours prior so it's just plain stupid to be concerned about that.But it could be my next launch attempt.
Me, Rob? I'm COUNTING ON being standing at the edge of the ramp with my carabiner dangling two seconds before my next launch attempt. I really can't imagine any other scenario. If I could I'd be scared much less shitless as I am as things are. And the absolute scariest thing I can think of is standing at the edge of a ramp two seconds before a launch attempt not being scared shitless that my carabiner was dangling.
And this is all about what seems to work for YOU and what YOU like. And doesn't have shit to do with anybody else.I like variety.
Just like Mike End-Of-Story Bomstad. Sometimes the third wire...Sometimes AUSSIE and sometimes not.
http://thetension.blogspot.com/2007_07_15_archive.html
...sometimes the first, second, or fourth. Anything to relieve the mind numbing monotony of always trying to execute procedures and tasks the same tedious way.
And when I've committed to launch sometimes I level the wings, hold the nose down, wait for a good straight in puff, thrust off hard... Sometimes I try other stuff.
REALLY...It helps to bring the thought process alive.
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3873/14559992972_97b1a2a525_o.png
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3900/14557433291_0d22597fd6_o.png
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http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5590/14374149620_03c742c998_o.png
...bring it alive!
And finely honed...Routine leads to boredom...
...peak proficiency.
As illustrated by stuff like THIS?:...which leads to reactive thinking...
http://www.newscientist.com/articleimages/dn8186/0-falcon-divebombing-starlings-wins-top-photo-prize.html
http://www.newscientist.com/data/images/ns/cms/dn8186/dn8186-1_700.jpg[/img]
Oh good. Another OPINION. Hard to imagine where hang gliding would be without the wealth of OPINIONS it has constantly being pulled out of asses and streaming in....which IMO...
1. So what's a GOOD "facsimile" of true thinking? The kind of rot you're spewing out?...is a poor facsimile of true thinking.
2. So Jon Orders has probably just finished up five months in jail for dropping an unhooked passenger a thousand feet. He was trained and certified under a protocol that allowed for ZILCH variety or facsimiles of true thinking. So where were your letters to Jon, his lawyer, the court, the press, PAC explaining how he'd been set up for inevitable failure? How 'bout your article in the magazine?
3. Lemme tell ya sumpin', asshole...
NEVER in the entire history of hang gliding has there been a long term instructor capable of TRUE THINKING. If there had been there'd have never been such things as:
- backup loops
- locking carabiners
- floating crossbars
- foot landing requirements
- traffic cones
- spiral fractures of the humerus
- narrow dry riverbed with large rocks strewn all over the place landing options
- tandem training
- sidewire failures
- center of mass tow bridles
- pro tow bridles
- releases within easy reach
- backup releases
- Linknives
- Birrenators
- 130 pound test pitch and lockout preventers
- Ryan Rooney instant hands free releases
- tow mast breakaway protectors
- the Cone of Safety
- the Aussie Method
- "Hook In!" plaques
- unhooked launches
- forum moderators
- Davis Straub
- opinions
4. So you've been doing all this "true thinking", right?
http://www.chgpa.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=6342
The view from the other end of the rope
The kind of true thinking that leads to a 0.1 percent failure in the most critical of the checks of prior to commitment - a rate that would max out a REAL aviation career at somewhere between one and a thousand flights. So tell me how all this extra true thinking you've been doing has benefitted to sport of hang gliding. If you'd had your head taken off by a meteorite forty years ago what would we now be missing? Who'd now be alive and well instead of toast?Jim Rooney - 2014/07/26 03:21:47 UTC
I thought of something else today. (I get a lot of time to think)...
5. How 'bout giving us some other examples of the benefits "true thinking" in this game we play? If "true thinking" is such an important edge in hang gliding how come there's not a four month old pinheaded Turkey Vulture on the planet that can't kick our asses in anything and everything we do blindfolded with a third of its primaries snipped off?
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24846
Is this a joke ?
When was the last time you heard about a Turkey Vulture repeatedly trying to land on dead quarter inch twigs, repeatedly snapping them, and appearing totally baffled by what was going on? "I can't figure out why I've had so many breaks so quickly. Maybe just coincidence."Davis Straub - 2011/08/28 15:26:28 UTC
Then again, Russell Brown had us double up behind him after six breaks in a row at Zapata. We couldn't figure out why we had so many breaks so quickly. Maybe just coincidence.
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=25015
Zippy pounds in
6. A launch ramp is THE ABSOLUTE *LAST* PLACE that you wanna be doing "true thinking" - or any other superfluous distracting CRAP like checking your chin strap, bar clearance, or backup loop or making sure your suspension isn't twisted. You're about to do THIS:Davis Straub - 2011/09/02 18:37:09 UTC
Concussions are in fact very serious and have life long effects. The last time I was knocked out what in 9th grade football. I have felt the effects of that ever since. It changes your wiring.
09-05019
http://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2928/13891086719_3ba7e65d38_o.png
you wanna make goddam sure you don't do THIS:
2-112
http://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7600/28811055456_925c8abb66_o.png
so you do THIS:
14-03129
http://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2912/13700562685_86575e9220_o.png
That's reactive thinking at its finest. You wanna do any facsimiles of TRUE thinking above and beyond that you be my guest. I totally encourage you to. One more dickheaded instructor I won't hafta deal with anymore and can honor with a Darwin Award and use as a cautionary tale.
There's one best place for that Peregrine to be to connect with a Starling. And there's one best place for the most vulnerable Starlings to be in order to minimize the chances of being connected with. And every goddam last one of them is doing his utmost to get there.
http://ceredigionbirds33.blogspot.com/2012_03_01_archive.html
That's also reactive thinking at its finest and exactly how things work on dogfights and XC comps. "True thinking" is a great place for the drawing board - which, by the way, is where you don't do any. It has ZERO place between the setup and breakdown areas and I DEFY you to cite a sane example.
-
Tad Eareckson
- Posts: 9161
- Joined: 2010/11/25 03:48:55 UTC
Re: You are NEVER hooked in.
http://ozreport.com/10.48
Not hooking in at the coast
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18695
How could this accident happen?
2. Make sure you don't tell us his last name.
...he's not using crew, all the stupid motherfucker needs to do is ALLOW the glider to float up...
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3911/14720992956_ed594708b3_o.png
...which would give him a more effective launch anyway...
Not hooking in at the coast
Yeah Davis...Davis Straub - 2006/03/01 15:45:17 UTC
These kind of accidents keep happening
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18695
How could this accident happen?
We've got all these total fuckin' douchebags doing and telling other total fuckin' douchebags to keep doing the same things over and over and, go figure, these kinds of ACCIDENTS keep happening.Davis Straub - 2010/01/28 06:10:17 UTC
I have tried to launch unhooked on aerotow and scooter tow.
Which public forum?Ben Hull-Bailey writes to a public forum...
Sam's what? These things aren't ACCIDENTS, motherfucker. This is natural selection operating at its best.No doubt news is starting to trickle down to people of Sam'a accident...
1. How 'bout filling in the gaps with the UNofficial version. I find those to be adulterated with much less in the way of lies and bullshit....while flying in Lanzarote this week so I'll fill in a few gaps with the official version...
2. Make sure you don't tell us his last name.
If he'd just taken it off and left it at launch and monkey barred he'd have had a much longer and more enjoyable flight.Sam was flying a Magic Kiss on the Famara cliffs on Feb 26th where he top landed to sort out an uncomfortable harness.
Good thing he held his glider down on his shoulders the whole way. Much easier, much better positive positive control that way.He landed a long way back because of the cliff-like profile at T/O and unclipped for the long walk forward.
So? He's gonna do a hook-in check within a couple seconds of launch per usual, right? What's it matter whether or not he'd clipped back in?After sorting the harness problem he went to relaunch but hadn't clipped back in.
He's gonna be ridge soaring a glassy smooth coastal site...As he launched, the glider lifted away from him as the ground fell away.
...he's not using crew, all the stupid motherfucker needs to do is ALLOW the glider to float up...
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3911/14720992956_ed594708b3_o.png
...which would give him a more effective launch anyway...
Cool. That's plenty enough to safely control the glider - as any tow pilot will be more than happy to tell you.He hung onto the base bar with one hand...
Oh well, that was bound to happen sooner or later anyway.... and managed to get his other hand up but couldn't haul himself into the A-frame. He held on for as long as possible to give maximum ground clearance then threw his 'chute which separated him and the glider.
Too many seconds for a soft landing WITHOUT the parachute, to few seconds for a soft landing WITH the parachute. Ain't life a bitch sometimes?He impacted some way below take-off a few seconds later.
I'da hovered around for thirty minutes watching him bleed to death. We get such better discussions about this issue when the motherfucker doesn't survive.The rescue helicopter hung around 30 mins while he was stabilised and he was airlifted.
Guess there wasn't much point in checking for brain damage - given the obvious and hopeless pre-existing condition.His injuries are a broken arm, broken shoulder blade, chipped pelvis and quite a nasty wound where he impacted with his hip. The doctors are satisfied he shouldn't have a complicated recovery and are mostly worried about any infection in his wound.
The kind who fly hang gliders. But the only people who actually launch unhooked are the off the scale stupid motherfuckers who refuse to do hook-in checks.It goes without saying he's extremely lucky as very few survive that sort of incident on what is effectively a cliff take off. His appraisal of the whole affair was "what kind of tosser forgets to clip in?"
Born an off the scale stupid motherfucker, knows it, totally cool with it.So it's clearly not affected his self-analytical personality.
He doesn't have any pilot friends and I wouldn't feel like talking to him even if you DID give us the contact info 'cause I know EXACTLY what his response would be. You bring these assholes back from the dead you're still not gonna be able to get them to do anything remotely resembling a hook-in check. But he'd get along great with Dan DeWeese, Greg Porter, Martin Apopot.We expect him home possibly on Wednesday 29th but more likely towards the weekend, depending on the Doctor's say so. He has his mobile with him in hospital and I'm sure would appreciate the odd text from some pilots.
No. But we're never gonna see it anyway.The incident report should make for interesting reading.
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Tad Eareckson
- Posts: 9161
- Joined: 2010/11/25 03:48:55 UTC
Re: You are NEVER hooked in.
Jump to next post:
http://www.kitestrings.org/post6467.html#p6467
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=31706
Hook in!
http://www.chgpa.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1166
Thoughts on responsibility...
But, of course, you've been trained by:
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=17404
Aerotow barrel release - straight or curved pin?
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1238
NZ accident who was the pilot?
But a little of the credit for should go to:
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either!
2. And I sure am glad this guy:
http://ozreport.com/forum/files/copy_2_of_imgp1239_197.jpg
http://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7220/13949046702_ccfa0fafab_o.png
http://www.thekiteboarder.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/opener-532x800.jpg
was just flatland towing too! You can get really fucked up if you do something like this off a ramp.
09-05019
http://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2928/13891086719_3ba7e65d38_o.png
Jump to top:
http://www.kitestrings.org/post6466.html#p6466
http://www.kitestrings.org/post6467.html#p6467
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=31706
Hook in!
Brad Barkley - 2014/08/16 00:26:12 UTC
Glad this guy was just flat-land towing. And no, it's not me....this was just a youtube find.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luZYnZ9pkds
Yeah dude...Hook in!
http://www.chgpa.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1166
Thoughts on responsibility...
You sure got that right. You've GOT to HOOK IN! PERIOD! 'Cause if you don't then you won't be hooked in. It all comes down to that!Scott Wilkinson - 2005/10/05 14:10:56 UTC
We visited Steve Wendt yesterday, who was visibly choked up over Bill's death. For Steve, it all comes down to one thing: you've got to hook in. Period.
But, of course, you've been trained by:
the best of the best! He' exceptionally knowledgeable. Hell...Brad Barkley - 89857 - H3 - Steve Wendt - 2013/08/05 - AT FL PL ST 360 CL FSL TUR
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=17404
Aerotow barrel release - straight or curved pin?
He's the one who signed off Jim Keen-Intellect Rooney's rating!Jim Rooney - 2010/05/31 01:53:13 UTC
BTW, Steve Wendt is exceptionally knowledgeable. Hell, he's the one that signed off my instructor rating.
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1238
NZ accident who was the pilot?
OUR Jim. Jim Rooney. The Jim in the article.Lauren Tjaden - 2006/02/21
I thought I should post this since the phone keeps ringing with friends worried about Jim and wanting information. Here is what I know. Yes, the Jim in the article is OUR Jim, Jim Rooney. It was a tandem hang gliding accident, and it involved a power line. I have no more information about the accident itself. The passenger apparently was burned and is hospitalized, but is not seriously injured. Jim sustained a brain injury. He was and is heavily sedated, which means the doctors don't know and can't test for how serious the brain injury is. He is in critical but stable condition.
But a little of the credit for should go to:
Matt Taber and Lockout Mountain Flight Park.H2 - 2012/03/19 - Daniel Zink
1. Gawd! The dumb sonuvabitch didn't hook in to the towline...Glad this guy was just flat-land towing.
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either!
2. And I sure am glad this guy:
http://ozreport.com/forum/files/copy_2_of_imgp1239_197.jpg
http://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7220/13949046702_ccfa0fafab_o.png
http://www.thekiteboarder.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/opener-532x800.jpg
was just flatland towing too! You can get really fucked up if you do something like this off a ramp.
It was neither. Only the glider got airborne.Christopher Albers - 2014/08/16 00:41:48 UTC
Sounded like FLPHG, not a tow.
Don't have to:Can you imagine towing?
Doug Hildreth - 1985/03
1984/05/07 - John Shook - 43 - Intermediate - Sesace, Arizona - Wills Wing Duck
Pilot with thirty to forty towing flights apparently hooked in only to the tow line and when he released at three hundred feet, pilot fell to his death.
That's why you always use an appropriate weak link with a finished length of 1.5 inches or less. An appropriate weak link with a finished length of 1.5 inches or less will prevent you from being dragged.He'd a been dragged in that scrub a bit! Ouch!
It would be a much greater joy to see idiot Brad doing one a few seconds after launch at Whitwell.michael170 - 2014/08/16 06:03:04 UTC
Always a joy to see another idiot doing a hook-in check a few seconds after launch.
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Jump to top:
http://www.kitestrings.org/post6466.html#p6466
![http://www.newscientist.com/data/images/ns/cms/dn8186/dn8186-1_700.jpg[/img]](http://www.newscientist.com/data/images/ns/cms/dn8186/dn8186-1_700.jpg%5B/img%5D){kind=link}
Re: You are NEVER hooked in.
A complicated launch technique and over all poor performance for a hand launch glider.
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Tad Eareckson
- Posts: 9161
- Joined: 2010/11/25 03:48:55 UTC
Re: You are NEVER hooked in.
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=31781
Another hang check lesson
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T19GtqUnXDo
That's DEFINITELY the ticket here...
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=22608
I made a scary mistake.
Really hard to go wrong with guessing the lesson here again is to do a hang check before launching.
Another hang check lesson
One of YOURS, asshole.Nic Welbourn - 2014/09/03 00:05:56 UTC
Canberra
One of ours...
Like I said....was VERY lucky...
Bullshit. YOUR Number One is stupidity. And there is no Number Two. And Number One isn't fixable. Good luck....to not be eating from a straw since his incident last weekend.
Complacency seems to remain as our #1 enemy.
Yep...Aside from that, I guess the lesson here again is to do a hang check before launching.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T19GtqUnXDo
That's DEFINITELY the ticket here...
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=22608
I made a scary mistake.
Really hard to go wrong with guessing the lesson here again is to do a hang check before launching.
But ONLY, of course, if doing a hang check SOMETIME before launching isn't possible. If you lift your glider to make your hang strap tight before launch (thus checking your connection with the glider) you automatically get a false sense of security. And that's a MUCH nastier dragon than just complacency.If that's not possible, lift your glider to make your hang strap tight before launch (thus checking your connection with the glider)...
Life....he was rather lucky to not lose his face/body.