http://www.ushawks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=1582
Rick Masters: Superiority of Hang Gliders
Scott C. Wise - 2014/10/01 19:11:59 UTC
I guess it is okay to analyze reported accidents here in your blog.
Don't ask Rick. He has no more control over anything there than any other serf. Ask your Dictator for life.
In searching around a bit I also found details about Joe Julik having just bought the new "topless" glider the afternoon/evening before. As a pilot with 20 years experience you'd think he'd be cautious and keep his speed up.
Bullshit. I'd think that his primary foci would be stopping it on his feet and perfecting his flare timing.
But my best guess, last night, given the "odd" descriptions of what happened was that at ~ 100 ft AGL...
MSL.
...he rotated up...
Why? Why did he need to do that?
- perhaps by grabbing one down tube first -
As opposed to totally letting go of the bar with both hands and grabbing the downtubes.
...that caused the glider to pitch up, stall...
Since when did a stall become an issue on The Bob Show?
...but also drop off (side slip) to one side. The glider is said to have violently flipped over after going into the dive, as if it tucked before(?) hitting ground.
BULL FUCKING...
http://www.startribune.com/local/277600661.html
Hang-gliding accident in southern Wisconsin kills Minnesota man | Star Tribune
Authorities say 57-year-old of Joseph Julik of Taylors Falls, Minnesota, was hang gliding at an airport north of Whitewater on Monday when his glider caught a wind shear, which caused it to pitch to one side and nosedive about 100 feet.
Jefferson County Sheriff's Chief Deputy Jeff Parker says the wingtip of Julik's glider struck another glider that was tethered to the ground, causing the aircraft to flip over.
...SHIT
This is some radical...
Fictional.
...behavior! Mainly it is hard for me to imagine a 20 year veteran hang glider pilot allowing so many things to go wrong. But then, that's the process that makes accidents bad - one mistake after the other, each magnifying the last.
1. How does this qualify as an accident?
2. Bullshit.
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=27086
Steve Pearson on landings
Steve Pearson - 2012/03/28 23:26:05 UTC
I can't control the glider in strong air with my hands at shoulder or ear height and I'd rather land on my belly with my hands on the basetube than get turned downwind.
Name some people who can control the glider in strong air with their hands at shoulder or ear height. Not flying the glider at a critical stage of the flight is the only mistake ANYONE needs to make.
There are times when it has been medically proven (later) that odd landing situations (crashes) similar to this were initially triggered by the pilot actually having a medical emergency (heart attack, let's say) while flying.
Yeah, right.
But in this case there is also the "new glider" complication.
Why should it matter? As long as you're stalling there's no possible way to get hurt - regardless of the wing you're flying.
Being his first flight on the glider Joe was doing a high altitude flight. He would VERY likely have been better off doing a few training hill runs. Better to find that the glider's CG is off to some degree (if it is) while your gliding at 10 feet than when you're at 100 ft.
Bullshit. He almost certainly towed up to a couple grand. Don't you think he'd have noticed if there were something significantly wrong with the glider before he got back down to a hundred?
There's also some mention about weather conditions being "pre-frontal" in that area on Monday.
Landing, hands off the control bar, prefrontal conditions... What could possibly go wrong?
I'd also mention that while the pilot was from Minnesota, the accident occurred in Whitewater Wisconsin. The newpaper article I found is also confusing in that they mention Cold Spring (Wisconsin). If anyone is interested in looking over the location in Google Earth the co-ords = Lat 42 degrees 51' 12", Long 88 degrees 45' 36" .
Looks like very flat land. Could be thermal turbulence could be caused by local farm fields, or, . . . (?) Looks like nothing significant to cause lee side rotor.
Or maybe an invisible dust devel.
Rick Masters - 2014/10/01 23:27:03 UTC
Scott C. Wise - 2014/10/01 19:11:59 UTC
I guess it is okay to analyze reported accidents here in your blog.
Of course. The best we can do is nail it. The worst is to discuss other actions that could lead to the same result. If it's a HG accident, it's probably the pilot's fault.*
Then it's not an accident.
If it's a PG accident, it's probably the paraglider that killed the poor guy.
That's not an accident either.
There's no whining here because the politically correct babies aren't allowed in.
That in your FAQs, Bob? Or do you just let the politically correct babies in and find some excuse for sabotaging, restricting, banning them when they start exercising free speech that doesn't meet with your approval?
They have to go to the other forums. You won't hear "Let's all wait for the investigation" here. You won't hear "He died doing what he loved" here. You won't hear "Out of respect for the family" here.
That's politically correct speech? Thanks for clueing me in.
Real pilots who are still alive need to review their potential for error immediately to avoid the fate of the poor guy in question.
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=25656
The young girl who died hang gliding solo
Jim Rooney - 2012/03/06 18:34:14 UTC
ND's onto it.
No one ever wants to wait for the accident investigation... they want to know "NOW DAMNIT!" and there's always a lot of self-serving arguments surrounding it.
And it's always the same.
The same damn arguments get drug up every time. And they're all just as pointless every time.
We have a system in place.
It works.
Let it work.
Our procedures are well established at this point in time and there are no gaping hidden holes that need to be addressed immediately.
RR asked what the status was.
ND's provided the answer (thank you).
Please take a deep breath. And wait.
Accident investigations involving fatalities take a long time. And by long, I mean they can take years.
(yes, years, I'm not kidding)
The sky is not falling.
That's what's important. Humans on soaring parachutes need to wake up and find an airframe before they are killed at random. If our speculations are proved right or wrong, so what?
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30971
Zach Marzec
Jim Rooney - 2013/02/09 18:30:26 UTC
Because it's one of those crusty old debates that HGs love to go round and round with.
It's like uttering the word "wheels"... the conversation instantly turns into the great wheel debate.
Sorry for the interruption.
Please continue with the speculation.
I'll be over here, doing something productive.
Jim Rooney - 2013/02/12 18:00:27 UTC
Your second statement is why.
I just buried my friend and you want me to have a nice little discussion about pure speculation about his accident so that some dude that's got a pet project wants to push his theories?
Deltaman loves his mouth release.
BFD
I get tired as hell "refuting" all these mouth release and "strong link" arguments. Dig through the forums if you want that. I've been doing it for years but unfortunately the peddlers are religious in their beliefs so they find justification any way they can to "prove" their stuff. This is known as "Confirmation Bias"... seeking data to support your theory... it's back-asswards. Guess what? The shit doesn't work. If it did, we'd be using it everywhere. But it doesn't stand the test of reality.
AT isn't new. This stuff's been worked on and worked over for years and thousands upon thousands of tows. I love all these egomaniacs that jump up and decide that they're going to "fix" things, as if no one else has ever thought of this stuff?
But back to the root of my anger... speculation.
Much like confirmation bias, he's come here to shoehorn his pet little project into a discussion. Please take your snake oil and go elsewhere.
Tune him up?
Yeah, sorry... no.
Jim Rooney - 2013/02/28 01:17:55 UTC
Well said Billo
I'm a bit sick of all the armchair experts telling me how my friend died.
Ah but hg'ers get so uppity when you tell them not to speculate.
Jim Rooney - 2013/03/07 18:24:58 UTC
You're the one advocating change here, not me.
I'm fine.
These are only questions if you're advocating change. Which I'm not. You are.
You're the one speculating on Zack's death... not me.
Hell, you've even already come to your conclusions... you've made up your mind and you "know" what happened and what to do about.
It's disgusting and you need to stop.
You weren't there. You don't know.
All you have is the tug pilot report, who himself says he doesn't know... and HE WAS THERE... and he doesn't know.
Ever heard of "Confirmation Bias"?
Because you're a textbook example.
You were out looking for data to support your preconceived conclusion, rather than looking at the data and seeing what it tells you... which is why this is the first time we've heard from you and your gang.
Go back to Tad's hole in the ground.
While you're there, ask him why he was banned from every east coast flying site.
At least we were thinking about consequences and examining realities or potential realities instead of shoving it under the rug or falsely blaming a helpless, falling human, as those soaring parachutists are so wont to do.
You won't be speculating on anything when Bob gets Jim Keen-Intellect Rooney over there.
*A lot of you guys love towing. I hate it.
That's OK, Rick. Tons of other stupid California dickheads who've never towed do too.
It kills a disproportionate number of good pilots.
Name one - motherfucker. Never once in the history of modern hang glider towing has a good pilot been seriously fucked up because he was towing. Shit equipment, procedures, operators, policies, conditions. Shit conditions don't care much whether your towing up or coming off a slope. The rest of the issues are fixable but pieces of shit like your buddy Bob do everything they possibly can to make sure it won't happen.
And I notice you sitting on your useless ass doing and saying NOTHING while Bob and Bill are insanely babbling about how harmless Rooney Links and the stalls they produce are.
And it's often used when it's not necessary.
1. Tell me when flying hang gliders is NECESSARY.
2. Assuming flying hang gliders is NECESSARY what are all the people who live in states that don't have shit in the way of soarable mountains supposed to do?
Arrogant fucking asshole.
Birrenators, Rooney Links, Dragonfly tow mast breakaways and their protectors, tug drivers who can fix whatever's going on back there by giving us the rope, releases within easy reach do exactly the same thing to people who wanna fly hang gliders in the vast stretches of the planet in which towing is NECESSARY what collapsing paragliders do. And if you actually gave a rat's ass about the safety of recreational soaring pilots you'd help us with the fixes instead of telling us how much you hate something that you're too stupid to understand or appreciate.
