Future pilots
- And I enjoy seeing punctuation marks at ends of sentences.
- Yep, thrill riders ALWAYS seem to enjoy rides. Then they cross hang gliding off their bucket lists and we never hear from them again.
The bridle can't wrap on the tow ring. It's long and thin. Long thin ones are designed not to whip around and accidentally tie themselves to the carabineer...Steve Davy - 2015/01/04 19:56:08 UTC
What is your plan for getting off tow when the bridle wraps on the tow ring?
http://ozreport.com/9.098
The thin 1500 pound aerotow bridle
...just like long thick ones. And he's got an appropriate Davis Link with a finished length of 1.5 feet or more on the other end. That's way thinner and thus has a chance of wrapping...Davis Straub - 2005/05/03
Bob Lane said that Quest Air sold over forty of their bridles (and Bob sold fifteen or twenty) during the Nationals. The Quest Air bridles use thicker Spectra and are designed not to whip around and accidentally tie themselves to the carabineer. Bob says his bridles will not do this either.
...much less than zero.
Who'da thunk? And as long as you're not bothering using a punctuation mark on the end of the sentence you might as well not bother capitalizing the first letter of the sentence - 'specially really long ones, over six words.Harald Steen - 2015/01/04 20:32:51 UTC
hook knife on pilot and on ground
Davis style bent pin piece of shit and an appropriate Davis Link with a finished length of 1.5 feet or more. Two more kinds of releases than I saw at the glider end of the rope.Gerry Grossnegger - 2015/01/04 20:37:47 UTC
I saw 2 kinds of releases at the glider end of the rope.
There are probably hook knives in ALL of the pockets of all the people within half a mile of that operation.Could be a hook knife in the pocket of the guy on the ATV.
'Specially the life of an innocent child sharing a minimal amount of the DNA of the joyride "pilot" and the purveyors and users of the kinda crap Harald's flying with.Steve Davy - 2015/01/05 03:34:00 UTC
I'm delighted to read that you have a bulletproof plan for getting off tow when the bridle wraps.
I would hate to read about an innocent child's life lost due to utter incompetence on the part of a joyride "pilot".
Such adorable little people of varying ages!Jim Rooney - 2015/01/05 07:10:03 UTC
What a wonderful experience you're giving these kids.
Well said!Bravo.
Which "people" here? I only heard one person express any concern - a person you've previously denounced as a Tad variety troll:The concern that people are expressing here...
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24846
Is this a joke ?
Jim Rooney - 2011/08/25 06:23:15 UTC
I was serious too... he sounds like Tad.
You're right too... at the end of the day, he's a Troll... just as Tad is a huge troll.
Jim Rooney - 2011/08/25 06:25:28 UTC
Nope... drat... just a plain ole troll.
But, an outted troll.
Jim Rooney - 2011/09/03 07:11:36 UTC
Troll dol dol de dol, gently down the stream.
Merrily merrily merrily merrily, life is but a dream.
Jim Rooney - 2011/09/04 10:38:07 UTC
I was trolling down the street one day.
In the very merry month of May.
Oh, we got totally demolished in 2013 so now we're gonna start cozying up to the Tad's Hole In The Ground Gang and try to pretend that's where we've been all along. Won't work very well, Jim. You've got too many statements on the record - and archived where Davis can't get to them....however does have merit, even if they're expressing it a bit harshly.
Was there a "short bridAl" somewhere in that video that I missed seeing?While the possibility of a short bridal...
How profound sounding. So you got some data to back that statement up, asshole? I say that above a pretty low minimum length the likelihood of a piece o' shit bridle like that is exactly the same as for a thirty footer - it's only the last foot that matters....snagging on release is a bit lower than a long bridal of an aerotow top release, it is still present.
Get fuckin' real. When have you ever been wrong about ANYTHING?You do appear to be using the lower portion of an aerotow rig, correct me if I'm wrong.
Semiliterate moron.The Kotch...
48-61616...release seen at one point with the solo pilot for contrast...
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7476/15585060964_544fd39cdd_o.png
Oh really? One of them......is more suited to this type of tow.
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=16384
Tow Release Malfunction
..."Chest Crushers"?Jim Rooney - 2010/03/26 20:54:43 UTC
Bent pin releases are indeed very very reliable. But 100%? Nope. It's exceptionally rare, but they jam. All mechanical things do.
If they were perfection, everyone would be using them. They're not. As with all things, they are a tradeoff. Having that big ole chunk of metal on my sternum as I depart a launch dolly, just a couple feet off the ground, is not my idea of a good situation to be in.
What do they call them again? "Chest Crushers"?
Oh stop. I'm not sure I can handle this much profoundness in a single post.Aerotowing and Scooter towing have a fundamental difference that should not be overlooked.
01-20314That weaklink...
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8590/16019985358_f16276031e_o.png
- I don't have a non-barrel shoulder......on the non-barrel shoulder....
http://www.flickr.com/photos/aerotowrelease/8313526097/
...in my configuration. I was never that stupid.
- As an emergency release? No fuckin' way. Focal point of a safe towing system!...might be a bit less help than expected...
- But you're totally OK with its LENGTH. Nothing at all wrong there.
Well yeah, if you're gonna start squeezing weak links you can lock out all the way into the ground....as even scooter towing is pressure regulated (by the centrifugal clutch).
Oh! Say "exponentially" again! I always get a hard on whenever you use four and five syllable words!In a lockout scenario, it's not likely to break. Aerotowing by contrast is static and lockout forces grow exponentially.
- But in aerotowing...They don't do so in winch towing.
01-001
http://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7375/12981378134_6d44d81e61_o.png
04-200
http://c2.staticflickr.com/4/3162/12980962685_5786637b33_o.png
07-300
http://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7441/12980980635_a22762812d_o.png
10-307
http://c2.staticflickr.com/2/1660/26132155836_82b94d6550_o.png
15-413
http://c2.staticflickr.com/4/3141/12981414774_e6ddd85c13_o.png
Really hard to beat.
- I don't really understand this aerotow versus winch issue...
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=14230
pro tow set-up
Ryan Voight - 2009/11/03 05:24:31 UTC
It works best in a lockout situation... if you're banked away from the tug and have the bar back by your belly button... let it out. Glider will pitch up, break weaklink, and you fly away.
During a "normal" tow you could always turn away from the tug and push out to break the weaklink... but why would you?
Have you never pondered what you would do in a situation where you CAN'T LET GO to release? I'd purposefully break the weaklink, as described above. Instant hands free release
In a lockout situation won't any halfway competent driver just lock up the winch so the glider pilot can just pitch out abruptly, blow that little piece of string, and save his ass?Jim Rooney - 2009/11/03 06:16:56 UTC
As for being in a situation where you can't or don't want to let go, Ryan's got the right idea. They're called "weak" links for a reason. Overload that puppy and you bet your ass it's going to break.
You can tell me till you're blue in the face about situations where it theoretically won't let go or you can drone on and on about how "weaklinks only protect the glider" (which is BS btw)... and I can tell ya... I could give a crap, cuz just pitch out abruptly and that little piece of string doesn't have a chance in hell. Take your theory and shove it... I'm saving my a$$.
Wait a minute... You're gonna start talking about some other thing to appreciate without a single word about the STRENGTH of the weak link? Aren't you gonna make sure he understands the critical importance of using 130 instead of that new deadly 200 stuff many of us are now happy with? What's the point of even having a weak link if it won't break when it's supposed to?The other thing to appreciate...
Oh please do elaborate. We muppets have always lacked sufficient appreciation for how fast emergency situations develop and how quickly they can be over (in a bad ways)......is how fast an emergency situation develops and how quickly it can be over (in a bad way).
Towing Aloft - 1998/01
Lockouts do not just magically happen to snatch a glider from the sky. They are generally progressive events originating from situations that can usually be terminated. The pilot and tow team must recognize these situations and the potential for acceleration into full lockout conditions so they can take appropriate corrective action prior to occurrence.
We've always assumed that in towing emergency situations we have all the time in the world - whereas it's the free flight emergencies in which one really has to have his shit together.Bill Bryden - 2000/02
The rapidity of the lockout was absolutely stunning to those observing the event. The glider went from being banked approximately 25 degrees and angled roughly 45 degrees to the towline, to being rolled over and pointed down in less than two to three seconds after the rollover.
Dennis Pagen informed me several years ago about an aerotow lockout that he experienced. One moment he was correcting a bit of alignment with the tug and the next moment he was nearly upside down. He was stunned at the rapidity. I have heard similar stories from two other aerotow pilots.
To whom? Name one single douchebag in the history of hang glider towing who's ever been comforted by the thought of having a hook knife within easy reach.The thought of a hook-knife is a comforting one...
http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=11497
Aerotow release options?
The only reason you motherfuckers were able to get away with putting assholes up on Rooney Links for a couple decades was because they were scared even more shitless by their Industry Standard "releases" within easy reach and thought that your magic fishing line might inconvenience them at just the right time in a lockout situation.Dallas Willis - 2009/04/13 18:44:46 UTC
Could you go into more detail about your push button truck tow release and the lanyard version you experimented with? I'm truck towing an awful lot lately and have yet to find a release that doesn't scare the heck out me.
Yeah. Cite some ACTUAL ones - pigfucker....and in certain scenarios it might prove useful.
Duh.However, in some very real possibilities, it will prove next to useless.
- As opposed to impacting a cloud.You could have perhaps enough time to put your hand on the handle of the knife. before impacting the earth.
- Wanna discuss anything about how much faster he's gonna impact the ground if he decides he can fly the glider just fine with one hand while he's making the easy reach to the handle of the hook knife with the other? Or are you worried that that might raise questions about how well one's gonna be able to control the glider while making the easy reach to an Industry Standard piece o' shit "release"?
God I wish I had an intellect as keen as yours. Everybody else I've been listening to has been understating how fast a lockout can happen and how quickly it can end.I can't overstate how fast a lockout can happen and how quickly it can end.
- Really? I was led to believe:It's simplicity to put a second barrel on.
- And make sure it's also got a bent pin so it will close easily over a thick rope with no weak link at the end.Towing Aloft - 1998/01
One drawback to single point is that it is not easy to incorporate a secondary release so a hook knife must be handy in flight.
- Name somebody who used twin barrels on a shoulder assembly prior to T** at K*** S******. I got razzed by the Ridgely crew when I did it before you "arrived".
- Or really? This total fucking moron is just duplicating what all the US aerotow assholes are doing. So how come this isn't standard/universal over here? If this shit really worked...You lose nothing for the effort and gain so much.
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30971
Zach Marzec
...then how come everyone isn't doing it everywhere? Must not be standing the test of reality. So how come you're not "refuting" it? Got too tired?Jim Rooney - 2013/02/12 18:00:27 UTC
I just buried my friend and you want me to have a nice little discussion about pure speculation about his accident so that some dude that's got a pet project wants to push his theories?
Deltaman loves his mouth release.
BFD
I get tired as hell "refuting" all these mouth release and "strong link" arguments. Dig through the forums if you want that. I've been doing it for years but unfortunately the peddlers are religious in their beliefs so they find justification any way they can to "prove" their stuff. This is known as "Confirmation Bias"... seeking data to support your theory... it's back-asswards. Guess what? The shit doesn't work. If it did, we'd be using it everywhere. But it doesn't stand the test of reality.
- But make sure you don't put weak links on both ends of the bridle. One really long one is OK but two short ones will double the towline pressure required to blow tow.
Yeah, that's exactly what he's been working with so far. Just like:Good luck with your operation.
37-23223
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3713/9655904048_89cce6423a_o.png
Yes Jim. YOU need to thank Harald for sharing the gift of flight with those kids.Thank you for sharing the gift of flight with these kids.
Yeah. They'll probably have to. 'Cause the statistical chances of somebody coming back after a tandem ride for actual pilot training are about one in a thousand.I'm sure they'll remember it forever.
Somebody find me a post by Jim Keen-Intellect Rooney in which he doesn't come off like he's certain he's God's Gift to aviation and everybody else is a total moron - with very little likelihood of surviving to the end of the month without him emphasizing the exponential increase in tow pressure during an aerotow lockout and how he can't overstate how fast a lockout can happen and how quickly it can end.
![]http://ozreport.com/pub/images/fingerlakesaccident4.jpg](%5Dhttp%3A//ozreport.com/pub/images/fingerlakesaccident4.jpg){kind=link}
