Weak links

General discussion about the sport of hang gliding
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: Weak links

Post by Tad Eareckson »

P.S.

ANY tow operation that even ALLOWS - let alone COMPELS - a glider over two hundred pounds to go up with a loop of 130 pound Greenspot is, in effect, stating that there can NEVER be a situation in which it can be dangerous for a glider to come off of tow.

So you can and MUST assume that...

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/skysailingtowing/message/6726
Give 'em the rope? When?
William Olive - 2005/02/11 08:59:57 UTC

I give 'em the rope if they drop a tip (seriously drop a tip), or take off stalled. You will NEVER be thanked for it, for often they will bend some tube.
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=14221
Tad's release
William Olive - 2008/12/24 23:46:36 UTC

I've seen a few given the rope by alert tug pilots, early on when things were going wrong, but way before it got really ugly. Invariably the HG pilot thinks "What the hell, I would have got that back. Now I've got a bent upright."

The next one to come up to the tuggie and say "Thanks for saving my life." will be the first.
http://www.chgpa.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2467
weak links
Jim Rooney - 2007/08/01

Whatever's going on back there, I can fix it by giving you the rope.

It's more of this crappy argument that being on tow is somehow safer than being off tow.
...you WILL be dumped by some asshole in a situation or emergency of ANY kind.
Steve Davy
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Re: Weak links

Post by Steve Davy »

http://www.willswing.com/blogs/PilotBlogs/tabid/38/BlogID/3/Default.aspx
The launch gets mired, and I learn later people had a hard time getting up and out. Many weak link breaks, many re-lights, etc. It's a bummer. I know the crew and tugs are working as hard as they can.
He gets the rope accidentally at 400ft. He drops it on the runway and works hard to low save from 200ft.
Steve Davy
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Re: Weak links

Post by Steve Davy »

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=23199
Santa Cruz Flats Race Day 1 & 2 - Video
I have only had 4 solo aero tows in my life and...
So, I broke my first weak link while towing downwind.
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: Weak links

Post by Tad Eareckson »

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=23199
Santa Cruz Flats Race Day 1 & 2 - Video
Axel Banchero - 2011/09/20 14:49:35 UTC
Miami Beach

Jonathan, are you aware of the consequences after a weak link break right off the cart? Get some wheels for aerotow.
Jonathan, are you aware of the consequences of flying with a frayed sidewire? Get a bigger parachute and a better helmet.

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=12536
standard operating procedures
Axel Banchero - 2009/06/18 15:42:14 UTC

I would like to improve my weak link setup so I am better than now at avoiding a low altitude break during launch and I want to start releasing sooner when I get into a lockout position as now I know the weak link won't do shit to save me.

I haven't seen any of those Tost or any other setups in a hang glider yet. I would be open to use a system like that if the park owners also approve it after learning the benefits and increased security.
Amazing how much damage an extra couple of years on The Jack Show can do to a human brain.
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: Weak links

Post by Tad Eareckson »

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=23199
Santa Cruz Flats Race Day 1 & 2 - Video
NMERider - 2011/09/20 16:31:28 UTC

I have only had four solo aero tows in my life and three were in the comp and one the day before. I'm lucky Jamie and Mitch have allowed me to fly. If not for the excellent Scooter Tow instruction from Mark Knight and Bill Bennett followed by the outstanding instruction from Mitch Shipley and the Quest crew, I would not have had been able to fly in the meet.

Also, if not for the thorough instruction of Mitch, weak link break at 10' may have had an unpleasant outcome. Don't forget that was a downwind launch folks!
I got news for ya, Jonathan - try to pay close attention...

A weak link break at ten feet off the cart in the course of a normal launch *IS* an unpleasant outcome - even if you don't have a subsequent downwind crash. A PLEASANT outcome - by way of comparison / contrast - would've been to tow up and go on task, strange as that may seem.

Too bad none of the assholes who taught and allowed you to tow were very well tuned into that concept.
Steve Davy
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Re: Weak links

Post by Steve Davy »

Is a downwind launch using a dolly considered to be reasonable?
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: Weak links

Post by Tad Eareckson »

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=23199
Santa Cruz Flats Race Day 1 & 2 - Video
NMERider - 2011/09/21 00:37:09 UTC

The wind switches 180 degrees and back here. There's little that can be done. I did two launches today and they were both very good. BTW - I do have wheels. It's called a launch cart and the trick is not to leave the runway until airspeed is high enough to safely glide to a landing. It's not difficult to keep the nose down and glider on the cart until hitting 35 mph airspeed.
He's perfectly OK on the decision to launch. It's freakin' amazing how much cross and tail wind gets taken out of the equation by a Dragonfly and launch dolly.

And, like he says, there's no law that says you need to come off the cart until/unless you have airspeed to burn - although it appears that he's using a brake lever on the starboard downtube which is a pretty good way to get yourself killed in the best of circumstances.
Lack of sleep; lack of ground streamers; turbulence; and fatigue from difficult (for me) flying.
Lack of streamers...

1990/07/05 - Eric Aasletten - Hobbs, New Mexico
Jerry Forburger - 1990/10

Dust devils plowed through the launch area and were almost invisible because the terrain around the airpark is mostly dry grass. There was not a lot of dust on the ground to help mark the devils.
Doug Hildreth - 1990/09

Reasonably proficient intermediate with over a year of platform tow experience was launching during tow meet. Homemade ATOL copy with winch on the front of the truck. Immediately after launch, the glider pitched up sharply with nose very high. Apparently the angle caused an "auto release" of the tow line from the pilot, who completed a hammerhead stall and dove into the ground. Observer felt that a dust devil, invisible on the runway, contributed to or caused the relatively radical nose-up attitude. Also of concern was the presumed auto release which, if it had not occurred, might have prevented the accident. Severe head injury with unsuccessful CPR.

The reporter (Dave Broyles) was certain he saw a dust devil begin on the edge of the runway in a location that would support an invisible dust devil on the runway crossing the path of the truck and glider.

Recommendation of the reporter: If towing is done in gusty, turbulent or thermal conditions, a row of wind flags should be on each side of the runway at 50-75 foot intervals to warn of invisible turbulence. 1) Pilots should attach their release line in such a way that there will not be an auto release. 2) Weak links should be strong enough so that breaks right after launch will not occur.
http://ozreport.com/4.010
Oz Nats - bad day in the tow paddock
Davis Straub - 2000/01/12

Mike Nooy takes off to our left, and he launches right into a dust devil. Like I said, they've been coming in every ten minutes or so, and you can't see them as the paddock is pretty green.

On static tow, if you are not pulling in quite strongly, your nose can go straight up. We've been watching this happen to all sorts of pilots around us especially in this high wind. Problem is your weaklink can snap and then you are stalled big time. Not a pleasant situation when you are low.

The best idea is to keep running, keep the nose down, and then power through the first hundred feet or so of altitude, before letting the nose out a bit. You want to tell your driver what the wind speed is before you start your tow, so they can know not to accelerate too quickly. They might have to stop or drastically slow down immediately after you get off the ground to keep the weaklink from breaking.

Mike takes off and of course his nose is high, which has been quite common today. He's yawing to the right and left very quickly back and forth as the dust devil is right under him. His glider then yaws very fast and hard to the left and immediately dives very hard into the ground from twenty or thirty feet. It is obvious as soon as the glider whips to the left that he is in very bad trouble.

I can't remember what hits first, Mike or his left wing, but it is a crushing impact. He is obviously not moving. Almost immediately Dr. James Freeman, a meet organizer and a physician, races to the lane, and gets Mike stabilized. An ambulance has also been called within less than a minute. Towing stops.

The ambulance takes about ten minutes or so to get out to the paddock from the town a ways away. James administers some shots, we log roll Mike onto the back plate, and then lift him onto the gurney and into the ambulance. He's on his way to the local hospital with James with him. He's unconscious, and has suffered extensive head injuries. His full-face helmet is broken on the right side where the jaw protector meets the head protection element. His legs are shaking.
http://ozreport.com/7.004
Death in the tow paddock
Davis Straub - 2003/01/05
Deniliquin, New South Wales

Hikobe Junko was killed today in the tow paddock after locking out during a car tow. She was on the left most car towing lane, about four lanes to the right of our aero towing lane. After locking out, she headed out of control toward our lane and almost hit Elsa Gleason who was helping Terry Presley to get ready to tow. She also almost hit Terry coming in 12 feet over him downwind.

She smashed into the ground next to our lane and could not be revived.

Car towing is relatively susceptible to lock out, but pilots who are carefully trained in the procedures know to pull the release and not try to save the tow. Save their life instead. It appears as though Hikobe did not pull her release when she got into trouble.

This kind of accident is quite rare, although getting off kilter on a car tow is not. Hitting a dust devil low has happened and I've witnessed the carnage that that can create. Pilots need to put small flags down the tow strip to check the wind.
2004/06/26 - Mike Haas - Hang Glide Chicago - Cushing Field - Sheridan, Illinois
Joe Gregor - 2004/09

The weak link broke after the glider entered a lockout attitude. Once free, the glider was reportedly too low (50-65' AGL, estimated) to recover from the unusual attitude and impacted the ground in a steep dive.
http://ozreport.com/9.179
Fatality Report
Angelo Mantas - 2005/08/30

Despite help reaching him almost instantly, attempts to revive him proved futile. Mike suffered a broken spinal cord and was probably killed instantly.

Soon after launching, the glider and tug flew through a strong thermal. This is confirmed by witnesses watching the tug, and the tug pilot's reporting a strong spike in climb rate.

Already struggling (as witnesses state), when Mike hit the thermal, a difficult situation became impossible. Mike lost control, and either locked out or stalled, leading to his dive into the ground.

How can we prevent this from happening in the future?

Wind streamers along runway. It's agreed that Mike hit a strong thermal shortly after launching. Placing streamers on both sides of the runway, at regular intervals, would help detect if a thermal is coming through the takeoff area. If all the streamers are pointing the same way, it's safe to launch. If some of the streamers start moving other directions or reversing, it's obvious some kind of turbulence is coming through. This is not a new idea, it's not expensive (wood stakes and surveyor's tape) yet I've never seen anyone do this. Maybe it's time we start.

Mike was a Hang IV pilot with over twenty years experience. He was not a "hot dog" and was very safety conscious. No one who knew Mike could believe that this happened to him. Although I feel I have a better understanding now of what happened, I can't help feeling that if this could happen to him, none of us are safe.
Yeah, maybe we should should have streamers on both sides of the runway at regular intervals. But maybe we should just keep talking after all the really good crashes about how we really should have streamers on both sides of the runway. Let's save the streamers for mountain launches - more money left over for beer and pizza that way.
On the weak break, many pilots would have piled in. The skid was the correct way to handle it. My relaxed, pre-comp landings have been fine. I haven't had to time to explain how my left knee went out during flight on day 1, and I could not stand when I came into land so it buckled.

BTW - I do have wheels. It's called a launch cart and the trick is not to leave the runway until airspeed is high enough to safely glide to a landing. It's not difficult to keep the nose down and glider on the cart until hitting 35 mph airspeed. I dislike having anything in my field of view when I'm flying other than my instrument pod. That goes for bar mitts as well as wheels. I just don't want them.
Except, of course he DIDN'T have wheels when he needed them. 'Cause he wasn't competent enough to get and STAY off the ground - even with the advantage of the cart and all that excess airspeed. And a roll is one helluva lot more correct a way to handle things than a skid - especially when you have a left knee that buckles.

But light a light weak link is about the only thing Rooney and Davis are concerned about enough to make mandatory to stack the deck in the "favour" of the pilot's safety equation. Insisting on wheels would be an intolerable infringement on the pilots' rights. And perish the thought that we should think about doing anything like that.

P.S. When I become Supreme Dictator of Planet Earth I won't force all aerotow pilots to use wheels - but they WILL all be using one and a half G weak links so I can at least eliminate all the downtube, arm, and neck breaks from the beginning of the flight.
---
2011/09/28

Oops. Jonathan isn't using a brake lever on the starboard downtube. I mistook some VG pulling just after release for some swiping at a lever just before release. He's undoubtedly using a Bailey Release at his right shoulder - also a pretty good way to get yourself killed in the best of circumstances.
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: Weak links

Post by Tad Eareckson »

http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24534
It's a wrap
Davis Straub - 2011/07/31 17:55:25 UTC

To break under load before the glider does.
Steve Davy - 2011/08/28 04:53:00 UTC
Davis Straub - 2011/08/26 14:04:52 UTC

We had six weaklink breaks in a row at Zapata this year.
It ONLY took six weak link breaks (in a row) to figure out something was wrong.
I am impressed. It's truly amazing. A fine display of perception, logic, and quick thinking.
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=25174
Build Your Own Weak-link Tester
Steve Davy - 2011/09/25 05:05:59 UTC

Another way to test a weak link. Slap it on and see what happens.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTa6XL16i0U
SCFR Day 2 Highlights
LAGlide - 2011/09/20
dead
021-02800
http://live.staticflickr.com/3848/14609177375_f8c224836d_o.png
Image
Image
http://live.staticflickr.com/5529/14422573378_5385a9a99a_o.png
057-03703

In this case we see that the weak link performed perfectly, it broke before the pilot could get in too much trouble.
http://ozreport.com/12.080
No one makes it back - Santa Cruz Flats Race, day two
Davis Straub - 2008/04/22 06:02:32 UTC
Casa Grande, Arizona

We were launching in light cross winds. I got on the cart but noticed that the back was too high. I ignored it and off we went. Then the glider was stuck to the cart. I finally jiggled it off the cart, but zoomed right up and blew the weaklink. Now I had to land down wind or cross wind. I tried hard as I could to get the glider to turn into the wind, but no luck (as I was only twenty feet high). So I just flared at the last second and that worked, although I was covered in dust.

I was not the only one breaking weaklinks as it seemed for a while every third pilot was having this problem. You've got to get the keel cradle set right.

Back on the cart again after a clean up and this time through the dust and into the air only to be knocked off the tug (I pulled the release) at 600'. The tug was going one way and I was going the other.
http://ozreport.com/12.083
Dusty - Santa Cruz Flats Race
Davis Straub - 2008/04/25 05:11:39 UTC

A novice competition flex wing pilot broke a weaklink on his second tow very low and got off at 300' on his tow. So that was further discouragement.
I finally jiggled it off the cart, but zoomed right up and blew the weaklink. Now I had to land down wind or cross wind.
Good thing it broke under load before your glider did, huh Davis?
I was not the only one breaking weaklinks as it seemed for a while every third pilot was having this problem. You've got to get the keel cradle set right.
So the problem was that every third glider was setting the keel bracket too high, getting stuck to the cart, having to jiggle off, zooming up, and blowing the weak link before the glider broke under load? Not that you assholes were forcing everybody up on the 130 pound Greenspot - the better weak link material for which we can thank Bobby Bailey and applaud his efforts to improve the safety of aerotowing?
Back on the cart again after a clean up...
And clogging the launch line instead of thermalling up and starting on task. How I do love standing in line and watching the conditions evaporate after coming a good chunk of the way across the continent to fly while I wait for assholes like you to get their shit together. Yes, do continue.
...and this time through the dust and into the air only to be knocked off the tug (I pulled the release) at 600'. The tug was going one way and I was going the other.
So when you zoom up coming off the cart but are in good shape to continue the tow your weak link blows? But when the tug's going one way and you're going the other it doesn't?

So is this drivel:

http://www.dynamicflight.com.au/WeakLinks.html
Weak Links - Dynamic Flight Hang Gliding School

a load of shit like God's Special Little Messenger says it is?
A novice competition flex wing pilot broke a weaklink on his second tow very low and got off at 300' on his tow. So that was further discouragement.
DISCOURAGEMENT?!?! How could he or anybody present POSSIBLY be discouraged?

The weak link broke under load before his glider did. Or maybe - if you listen to God's Special Little Messenger - it prevented him from locking out and slamming in really hard. Hell, it probably served BOTH functions simultaneously!

And if he had blown the launch his injuries would've been limited to the breaking of just four ribs and one larynx.

So I'da thunk that he and everyone present would've had tears of relief and joy streaming through the dust on their cheeks. I simply don't understand you people.
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Tad Eareckson
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Re: Weak links

Post by Tad Eareckson »

http://ozreport.com/12.081
Weaklinks - the HGFA rules
Davis Straub - 2008/04/22 14:47:00 UTC

At the 2008 Forbes Flatlands Greenspot for the first time was used as the standard weaklink material (thanks in large part to the efforts of Bobby Bailey). We applaud these efforts to improve the safety of aerotowing by using a better weaklink material.
http://ozreport.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24846
Is this a joke ?
Davis Straub - 2011/08/26 14:04:52 UTC

We had six weaklink breaks in a row at Zapata this year.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TTTFlymail/message/11545
Cart stuck incidents
Keith Skiles - 2011/06/02 19:50:13 UTC

I witnessed the one at Lookout. It was pretty ugly. Low angle of attack, too much speed and flew off the cart like a rocket until the weak link broke, she stalled and it turned back towards the ground.
So Davis...
- What were you using as the "standard" weak link material at the 2007 Forbes Flatlands?
- What's the flying weight of a "standard" glider?
- Did you have any nonstandard gliders participating in the 2007 or 2008 events?
- What dangerous problems were you having with the old weak link material that were eliminated by the 130 pound Greenspot?
- Where did you hide the bodies?

http://www.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=21033
barrels release without any tension except weight of rope..
Bart Weghorst - 2011/02/25 19:06:26 UTC

But I've had it once where the pin had bent inside the barrel from excessive tow force. My weaklink was still intact. The tug pilot's weaklink broke so I had the rope. I had to use two hands to get the pin out of the barrel.
No stress because I was high.
- Aren't you gonna applaud Bobby for his efforts to improve the safety of aerotowing by developing a better release mechanism?
Steve Davy
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Re: Weak links

Post by Steve Davy »

In this case we see that the weak link performed perfectly, it broke before the pilot could get in too much trouble.
Think anyone noticed that was sarcastic?
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